Scientologirl - New Independent Scientologist

[I told you I was trouble]

No words written by me above (or anywhere else) state or imply any such thing. I am not responsible for other people "dubbing in" completely false "interpretations". I don't write "between the lines".

I mean, for fuck's sake, I took Standard English grammar and composition for five years straight with mostly A's. I write Standard English. I do not now and never have written any invisible words as you seem to think - they never taught that in school. I mean this: if I ever want to insult the whole group, I will do it directly and not by some sort of sly, covert insinuation or implication.

The person addressed (Scientologirl) says she is practicing Scientology and her videos state she is associated with a "Standard Tech" Indie group (Johnathon Burke and AOGP), so it is entirely appropriate for myself - another Scientologist - to point out to her that she is doing it wrong with the appropriate Hubbard reference.

In actual fact, I was backing up JustSheila, who pointed out the inappropriateness of the communication earlier on the thread.

Awwww, Sneaks ... do try to get over yourself, I was just riffing with you.

I couldn't give a tinker's toss (and I doubt if anyone else around here could) whether you believe we need help and are so easily antagonised or not. I found your KR to Scientologirl a bit surprising though. I doubt if she needs a personal ethics officer but at least she'll know who to go to now if ever she does, so ... keep your clipboard well serviced.

 

[Dotey OT]

This is dated (revised) after Hubbard's death, and would likely not be used by an Independent Scientologist. Some Independent Scientologists don't abide by every Hubbard administrative dictate.,

In any event, are you trying to dissuade Scientologirl for posting here?

Trying to get her to talk and take a look. What do you think she was trying to do?

 

[He-man]

To me that seems like too high a percentage.

As there are currently, say 15,000 people still in, it would mean that in the cults total lifespan it had 1,5 million members. I don't think that is realistic? See Estimates for new members and total membership

So the good news is that the COS did not have 1.5 million members, but the bad news is that as a percentage more people are still in.

I would honestly say that is realistic if you include anyone who ever took part of a div 6 course and then subsequently fled. It might even be too low.

 

[TheSneakster]

I couldn't give a tinker's toss (and I doubt if anyone else around here could) whether you believe we need help and are so easily antagonised or not.

No. You apparently don't give a toss about falsely attributing made-up lies to me. That's really too bad, I thought you were somebody above that sort of conduct.

I found your KR to Scientologirl a bit surprising though.

There was no Knowledge Report. You just made up that lie, too.

 

[I told you I was trouble]

No. You apparently don't give a toss about falsely attributing made-up lies to me. That's really too bad, I thought you were somebody above that sort of conduct.



There was no Knowledge Report. You just made up that lie, too.

Read this carefully petal, because it'll be my final response to you on this subject.

Your post (which I half seriously replied to through my laughter) contained the following line "If you actually intend to help any of these folks" and it implied (to me) that you may have thought we could indeed 'need help' (using standard tek only) and it would have been no big surprise to anyone if you felt that way about a group of very naughty defrocked apostates!

Having said that, I know you're a very straight speaker and have always admired you for that so I apologise if I offended you and accept that you didn't mean it that way.

PS I am not any kind of liar.

 

[TheSneakster]

it would have been no big surprise to anyone if you felt that way about a group of very naughty defrocked apostates!

Look, man (or lady)... "defrocked apostate" is made-up OSA language not found anywhere in Hubbard's Scientology writings. Only OSA PR @ssholes pretending to be Roman Catholics speak that way. I doubt very much that OSA staff or their minions even *think* that way.

I keep saying this and it keeps getting ignored: I'm a declared and expelled Suppressive Person over in the Co$ which makes me an "apostate" to them along with the rest of you all (except for the never-ins). Getting in OSA's way is something of a hobby.

There is no Indie group I am affiliated with, either. I'm not a trained, qualified Scientology auditor, so I have no particular interest in anybody's "processing" or lack thereof.

A little story that maybe will help some of you all better understand me:

Back in December 2013 (IIRC), I personally derailed one of OSA's real world dirty tricks operations intended to jail a disaffected Flag public pre-OT on false assault and battery charges!

Gale Voight was the owner of CarSearch.Com (the first used car search engine and a lucrative business). Gale had been auditing on Solo NOTS when he became disaffected with the organization and quit showing up. He refused to be sec checked and the Sea Ogres decided to get tough with him. OSA got his wife to lock him out of his own house and attempt to set him up to be arrested on false assault charges, so she could steal all the business clients and turn over all his computers to OSA.

I was with him at his office backing up all his files and helping him change all his passwords because a mutual friend had a premonition of serious trouble and had asked me to go along as a protector. His wife and daughter show up, to create a scene and she actually assaulted him by trying to rip a phone out of his hand (I was told this phone had contact info for a number of CC INT public members). She then threatened to have him arrested in front of me (per the script they were given, by their OSA handler, no doubt).

Well nobody was counting on him having backup present [edit addendum: this incident took place around 2AM at his car lot in Eagle Rock, CA]. His wife was on the phone with her handlers. I told her straight up to go ahead and call the police and I would tell them exactly what I saw - her assaulting him. The result, I told her, would be two against two and a he said/she said standoff that would go nowhere.

The Evil plot was neatly torpedoed. Gale did not go to jail, she did not get to steal his business clients and OSA did not get his [edit: office ] computers to rifle for all his contacts.

She took a digital camera photo of me to pass along to her OSA handlers because I refused to identify myself to her other than "a friend of Gale". So, I'm a for-real OSA enemy and target for that - which I have never spoken of before on either version of ESMB.

OSA Int Internet Investigations Unit doesn't like me for multiple reasons. One of those reasons is that I am here in "enemy critic" territory, not hiding my Identity from them and not hiding the fact that I am an Indie Scientologist and trying mighty hard to get along with people I'm supposed to hate. Division among Darth Midget's enemies only serves him. My continued presence here is a middle finger to D.M.'s Demented Minions who took away my two closest friends.

Having said that, I know you're a very straight speaker and have always admired you for that so I apologise if I offended you.

OK, well an honest misunderstanding must be forgiven. I know I am at times too abrasive, too OCD and too stubborn, and too everything else. I assure you I am as damaged as pretty much anyone else who got fed up and left Co$ under their own power. I'm sorry.

 

[Veda]

-snip-

Edit Addendum: in my 8+ years of experience in the Sea Organization, this HCO PL was increasingly violated by superiors addressing subordinates. Increasing in both frequency and viciousness under the regime of Dick-tater David "Darth Midget" Miscavige as he pushed his reverse Scientology people handling tech down through the organization from the top. What you have done is just more of the same.

The HCOPL you quoted concerned tactful treatment of "wogs" - as Hubbard called them - not other Scientologists. Hubbard evaluated and invalidated Scientologists with all sorts of categories, terms, SP Declares, assignments to the RPF and RPF's RPF ("Degraded Being"), etc.

It's notable that, during the time period of this HCOPL, Hubbard was overseeing his covert attacks on ("wog") author Paulette Cooper to have her criminally framed and institutionalized in prison or a mental institution.

So, assuming that Hubbard wrote the words you quoted, Hubbard did not always follow his own advice. (That's partly because Hubbard designed Scientology to be covertly stratified, but that's another topic.)

After late 1968, with the faux "cancellation" of Fair Game (which went covert for PR and legal reasons), Security Checking (which was renamed "Integrity Processing" for several years), and Disconnection (which became more covert, quieter, and tactful - again for PR reasons - Hubbard extensively expanded the "tech" of Fair Game and its use, thought-policing via (renamed) Security Checking continued. and Disconnection continued, and, most certainly, SP Declares continued.

Personally, I would prefer that Scientologirl be direct and blunt, and not use PR tactics, while communicating here.

 

[Veda]

Trying to get her to talk and take a look. What do you think she was trying to do?

Thanks for the clarification.

 

[Irayam]

To me that seems like too high a percentage.

As there are currently, say 15,000 people still in, it would mean that in the cults total lifespan it had 1,5 million members. I don't think that is realistic? See Estimates for new members and total membership

So the good news is that the COS did not have 1.5 million members, but the bad news is that as a percentage more people are still in.

In fact, I have no idea about this percentage, I must confess. I said 99, but it could be less. 95% ?
What I know, it’s a very high percentage that leaves quickly. And don’t forget the turnover.

 

[Zertel]

Look, man (or lady)... "defrocked apostate" is made-up OSA language not found anywhere in Hubbard's Scientology writings. Only OSA PR @ssholes pretending to be Roman Catholics speak that way. I doubt very much that OSA staff or their minions even *think* that way.

I keep saying this and it keeps getting ignored: I'm a declared and expelled Suppressive Person over in the Co$ which makes me an "apostate" to them along with the rest of you all (except for the never-ins). Getting in OSA's way is something of a hobby.

There is no Indie group I am affiliated with, either. I'm not a trained, qualified Scientology auditor, so I have no particular interest in anybody's "processing" or lack thereof.

A little story that maybe will help some of you all better understand me:

Back in December 2013 (IIRC), I personally derailed one of OSA's real world dirty tricks operations intended to jail a disaffected Flag public pre-OT on false assault and battery charges!

Gale Voight was, the owner of CarSearch.Com - the first used car search engine and a lucrative business. Gale had been auditing on Solo NOTS when he became disaffected with the organization and quit showing up. He refused to be sec checked and the Sea Ogres decided to get tough with him. OSA got his wife to lock him out of his own house and attempt to set him up to be arrested on false assault charges, so she could steal all the business clients and turn over all his computers to OSA.

I was with him at his office backing up all his files and helping him change all his passwords because he anticipated serious trouble. His wife and daughter show up, to create a scene and she actually assaulted him by trying to rip a phone out of his hand (I was told this phone had contact info for a number of CC INT public members). She then threatened to have him arrested in front of me (per the script they were given, by their OSA handler, no doubt).

Well nobody was counting on him having backup present. She was on the phone with her handlers. I told her straight up to go ahead and call the police and I would tell them exactly what I saw - her assaulting him. The result, I told her, would be two against two and a he said/she said standoff that would go nowhere.

The Evil plot was neatly torpedoed. Gale did not go to jail, she did not get to steal his business clients and OSA did not get his computer to rifle for all his contacts.

She took a digital camera photo of me to pass along to her OSA handlers because I refused to identify myself to her other than "a friend of Gale". So, I'm a for-real OSA enemy and target for that - which I have never spoken of before on either version of ESMB.

OSA Int Internet Investigations Unit doesn't like me for multiple reasons. One of those reasons is that I am here in "enemy critic" territory, not hiding my Identity from them and not hiding the fact that I am an Indie Scientologist and trying mighty hard to get along with people I'm supposed to hate. Division among Darth Midget's enemies only serves him. My continued presence here is a middle finger to D.M.'s Demented Minions who took away my two closest friends.



OK, well an honest misunderstanding must be forgiven. I know I am at times too abrasive, too OCD and too stubborn, and too everything else. I assure you I am as damaged as pretty much anyone else who got fed up and left Co$ under their own power. I'm sorry.

When I started reading the scn blogs after watching Going Clear in 2015 there was still a lot of rational debate about the potential pros and cons of various aspects of scn with some indies and others finding some parts of it remaining useful. That has pretty much dried up with most people on the blogs already having expressed their opinions and not wishing to go into it again.

Scn-girl mentions some parts of the subject she feels are worthwhile, perhaps hoping for some worthwhile feedback but that's unlikely on any blog that I'm aware of.

 

[Veda]

When I started reading the scn blogs after watching Going Clear in 2015 there was still a lot of rational debate about the potential pros and cons of various aspects of scn with some indies and others finding some parts of it remaining useful. That has pretty much dried up with most people on the blogs already having expressed their opinions and not wishing to go into it again.

Scn-girl mentions some parts of the subject she feels are worthwhile, perhaps hoping for some worthwhile feedback but that's unlikely on any blog that I'm aware of.

Strictly speaking, this isn't a blog, it's a message board, and, I think, there's been some worthwhile feedback, including of a positive nature, on this message board in threads involving Scientologirl.

Although it seems that the search function, and other functions, over at original ESMB, seem to be currently inoperative, I've found that using google search with exscn, find all threads by____________, or ex.scn, _____(insert word)______ is effective in turning up a lot of content.

To stimulate thought, and provide three dimensionality, I have occasionally started threads such as this: Link to Good Experiences in Scientology thread.

 

[I told you I was trouble]

Look, man (or lady)... "defrocked apostate" is made-up OSA language not found anywhere in Hubbard's Scientology writings. Only OSA PR @ssholes pretending to be Roman Catholics speak that way. I doubt very much that OSA staff or their minions even *think* that way.

I keep saying this and it keeps getting ignored: I'm a declared and expelled Suppressive Person over in the Co$ which makes me an "apostate" to them along with the rest of you all (except for the never-ins). Getting in OSA's way is something of a hobby.

There is no Indie group I am affiliated with, either. I'm not a trained, qualified Scientology auditor, so I have no particular interest in anybody's "processing" or lack thereof.

A little story that maybe will help some of you all better understand me:

Back in December 2013 (IIRC), I personally derailed one of OSA's real world dirty tricks operations intended to jail a disaffected Flag public pre-OT on false assault and battery charges!

Gale Voight was the owner of CarSearch.Com (the first used car search engine and a lucrative business). Gale had been auditing on Solo NOTS when he became disaffected with the organization and quit showing up. He refused to be sec checked and the Sea Ogres decided to get tough with him. OSA got his wife to lock him out of his own house and attempt to set him up to be arrested on false assault charges, so she could steal all the business clients and turn over all his computers to OSA.

I was with him at his office backing up all his files and helping him change all his passwords because a mutual friend had a premonition of serious trouble and had asked me to go along as a protector. His wife and daughter show up, to create a scene and she actually assaulted him by trying to rip a phone out of his hand (I was told this phone had contact info for a number of CC INT public members). She then threatened to have him arrested in front of me (per the script they were given, by their OSA handler, no doubt).

Well nobody was counting on him having backup present. She was on the phone with her handlers. I told her straight up to go ahead and call the police and I would tell them exactly what I saw - her assaulting him. The result, I told her, would be two against two and a he said/she said standoff that would go nowhere.

The Evil plot was neatly torpedoed. Gale did not go to jail, she did not get to steal his business clients and OSA did not get his computer to rifle for all his contacts.

She took a digital camera photo of me to pass along to her OSA handlers because I refused to identify myself to her other than "a friend of Gale". So, I'm a for-real OSA enemy and target for that - which I have never spoken of before on either version of ESMB.

OSA Int Internet Investigations Unit doesn't like me for multiple reasons. One of those reasons is that I am here in "enemy critic" territory, not hiding my Identity from them and not hiding the fact that I am an Indie Scientologist and trying mighty hard to get along with people I'm supposed to hate. Division among Darth Midget's enemies only serves him. My continued presence here is a middle finger to D.M.'s Demented Minions who took away my two closest friends.

That's quite a story Sneaks ... thanks very much for telling it, it would have been an incredibly hard thing to do and your friend was very lucky that you were there, I hope he appreciated it.

I suppose I have an old inbuilt viewpoint (and I doubt I'll ever lose it now) that a scientologist is constantly evaluating, assessing and scrutinising others for 'outpoints' and it was that, among other things, that I wanted to be free of when I left the cult. It's my belief that scientology creates a kind of restrained personality disorder, an introversion of sorts because everyone involved is aware of the same tek, they are all using it around each other and with outsiders ... and people within the cult would almost certainly temper their communication and personalities accordingly.

Scientologists (in the main) want to appear to be 'uptone, upstat, causative, effective, on source, ethical, knowing, intelligent ... and all those other cult encouraged and approved things. I always felt I was being analysed when anywhere near a scientologist and while I was still involved I was probably automatically doing the same thing to others and it was no way to live (for me).

When I left I discarded everything to do with scientology virtually overnight ... I'm a great believer in not clinging to a mistake just because I spent a long time making it ... and I'm still wary of scientologists even here on ESMB ... I plan to try and avoid that inbuilt response (though I can't promise).

Anyway, I'm writing this post to say that if I ever find myself 'in the trenches' I hope you are right there with me, you have taken a lot of flack over the years (and I expect you'll agree that some of it was deserved) but I hope you know that your presence here is a positive thing and you are respected.

 

[Dotey OT]

Thanks for the clarification.

I answered. I did ask you a question, I don't know if you noticed, didn't care to answer or have an opinion. Or whether just crickets from here on out.

 

[Riddick]

Look, man (or lady)... "defrocked apostate" is made-up OSA language not found anywhere in Hubbard's Scientology writings. Only OSA PR @ssholes pretending to be Roman Catholics speak that way. I doubt very much that OSA staff or their minions even *think* that way.

I keep saying this and it keeps getting ignored: I'm a declared and expelled Suppressive Person over in the Co$ which makes me an "apostate" to them along with the rest of you all (except for the never-ins). Getting in OSA's way is something of a hobby.

There is no Indie group I am affiliated with, either. I'm not a trained, qualified Scientology auditor, so I have no particular interest in anybody's "processing" or lack thereof.

A little story that maybe will help some of you all better understand me:

Back in December 2013 (IIRC), I personally derailed one of OSA's real world dirty tricks operations intended to jail a disaffected Flag public pre-OT on false assault and battery charges!

Gale Voight was the owner of CarSearch.Com (the first used car search engine and a lucrative business). Gale had been auditing on Solo NOTS when he became disaffected with the organization and quit showing up. He refused to be sec checked and the Sea Ogres decided to get tough with him. OSA got his wife to lock him out of his own house and attempt to set him up to be arrested on false assault charges, so she could steal all the business clients and turn over all his computers to OSA.

I was with him at his office backing up all his files and helping him change all his passwords because a mutual friend had a premonition of serious trouble and had asked me to go along as a protector. His wife and daughter show up, to create a scene and she actually assaulted him by trying to rip a phone out of his hand (I was told this phone had contact info for a number of CC INT public members). She then threatened to have him arrested in front of me (per the script they were given, by their OSA handler, no doubt).

Well nobody was counting on him having backup present. She was on the phone with her handlers. I told her straight up to go ahead and call the police and I would tell them exactly what I saw - her assaulting him. The result, I told her, would be two against two and a he said/she said standoff that would go nowhere.

The Evil plot was neatly torpedoed. Gale did not go to jail, she did not get to steal his business clients and OSA did not get his computer to rifle for all his contacts.

She took a digital camera photo of me to pass along to her OSA handlers because I refused to identify myself to her other than "a friend of Gale". So, I'm a for-real OSA enemy and target for that - which I have never spoken of before on either version of ESMB.

OSA Int Internet Investigations Unit doesn't like me for multiple reasons. One of those reasons is that I am here in "enemy critic" territory, not hiding my Identity from them and not hiding the fact that I am an Indie Scientologist and trying mighty hard to get along with people I'm supposed to hate. Division among Darth Midget's enemies only serves him. My continued presence here is a middle finger to D.M.'s Demented Minions who took away my two closest friends.



OK, well an honest misunderstanding must be forgiven. I know I am at times too abrasive, too OCD and too stubborn, and too everything else. I assure you I am as damaged as pretty much anyone else who got fed up and left Co$ under their own power. I'm sorry.

"OK, well an honest misunderstanding must be forgiven. I know I am at times too abrasive, too OCD and too stubborn, and too everything else. I assure you I am as damaged as pretty much anyone else who got fed up and left Co$ under their own power. I'm sorry."

ok Hobson, I'm budding in. LOL You are who you are. Peace out.

 

[Karen#1]

I can corroborate Michael Hobson's story on Gale Voigt as I was on the side lines as it went down.

Gale is the person LA Scientologists visited when they needed a car or wanted to get rid of a car.
As time went by Gale, who had done everything the Bridge dictated up to OT 7 was wise enough and savvy enough to read the Internet to get the bigger picture.
So his wife KNOWLEDGE REPORTED him. His daughter knowledge reported him for visiting Internet sites.

In the cult of SCN...a snitching culture, spouses report on each other. Children snitch on the parents. Siblings rat out each other.

EVERYBODY REPORTS TO THE MOTHER CHURCH AND RTC.
OSA received these reports, OSA went into action and summoned him to OSA INT for expensive Sec Checks.
Gale declined and had some visits giving him ultimatums...

Emily Becker visited him with a final warning, if he did not report for sec checks, he would be SP declared.

|Gail had been in some 40 years and had already spent hundreds of thousands of dollars doing everything the cult wanted

til Solo OT 7.
One day Gale goes home to find out he has been locked out of his own home.


His laptop was confiscated by his wife and given to OSA and his wife threatened to lock him out of his work computer and all his mailing lists.

Gale was lucky to have Mike Hobson there or he would have been towed off to jail.
That night he slept in the little office and quickly changed all the passwords.

The house he had paid the mortgage on all those years had been taken over by his wife in cahoots with OSA.
Gale has lost his wife and children who are deeply in the tunnel,.
So that is the end of the road after 40 years in the Cult...
Gale Voigt

 

[Veda]

I answered. I did ask you a question, I don't know if you noticed, didn't care to answer or have an opinion. Or whether just crickets from here on out.

You asked, "What do you think she was trying to do?"

I accepted her answer when she was asked about her goal on ESMBR:

I don't have one, I guess. Right now, just to be interested.

__________________

If Scientologirl returns, if it's no too personal, I'd be curious to know what auditing she has had so far.

Are you on the Lower Grades? Have you thought about whether or not you want to do the Dianetic Clear route, or the Power Processing, R6 end words, and Clearing course route?

Do you plan to do the old upper OT levels no longer delivered by corporate Scientology?
'
I hope you will read and consider the many links I provided.

The objective was to help.



​

 

[HelluvaHoax!]

.

In fact, I have no idea about this percentage, I must confess. I said 99, but it could be less. 95% ?
What I know, it’s a very high percentage that leaves quickly. And don’t forget the turnover.

.

I have researched and scientifically verified the percentage of blown Scientologists.

It's 97.5%.

The remaining 2.5% who remain loyal to the disgracefully debunked tech are com-laggers and stragglers.

Dr. Hubbard describes this phenomena in great detail within the HCOB "The Anti-Comlagger Personality - The Anti-Stragglerologist".


.

 

[TheSneakster]

Gale was lucky to have Mike Hobson there or he would have been towed off to jail.
That night he slept in the little office and quickly changed all the passwords.

Gale slept in one of those big recliners. I also slept on the floor in that office that night upon some gym mats or something between him and the door. I had brought blankets.

The backups took hours. But I also wanted him to feel safe so he could sleep properly as he told me he had not gotten proper sleep for several days.

I was fully prepared to wake up, be on my feet and ready to do combat with anyone coming through that office door. Thankfully, his wife and OSA were not stupid enough to push it that far.

 

[Karen#1]

The cult of Scientology maliciously breaks up marriages and destroys the family unit.

There are always 3 people in a marriage in the cult of scientology.
(and even in the marital bed where knowledge reports are written up on private pillow talk.)

In Gale's case like so many others, the cult destroyed a 30 year marriage as REVENGE for Gale reading the Internet
and not bending to control enough to report for sec checks confessionals. His crimes were that he was reading sites that exposed the darker side of the cult ! Cult definition of *CRIME*.

SP declare for reading the Internet !

SP declare is just a political tool and is a triumph and badge of honor these days.

BUT no fun to lose family.

 

[ISNOINews]

Scientologirl,

After the Church of Scientology International (COSI) stated that it "has no position on sexual orientation" and later stated that "[t]he Church is on record as being opposed to discrimination of any sort, including on the basis of sexuality," I created a questionnaire for journalists to pursue the issue with COSI:

The Church of Scientology says it "has no position on sexual orientation." We have questions.

Thereafter, the Independent Reformed Church of Scientology at least partly (but only partly) addressed the issue of discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation:

The Independent Reformed Church of Scientology addresses discrimination on the basis of sexual orientation.

Because you were kind enough to join ESMBR, I modified the questionnaire for the Advanced Organization of the Great Plains (AOGP) as follows:

1) Does AOGP perform gay weddings? If AOGP hasn't done so to date, Is AOGP willing to perform gay weddings?

2) Does AOGP support adoption by gay couples?

3) If AOGP supports adoption by heterosexual individuals, does AOGP also support adoption by gay individuals?

4) Can a gay person become and remain a member AOGP in good standing without being required to be celibate, without being required to eventually become heterosexual, and while continuing to have gay sex subject only to the same ethical requirements applied to heterosexuals?

5) Can a gay person become and remain Clear in good standing without being required to be celibate, without being required to eventually become heterosexual, and while continuing to have gay sex subject only to the same ethical requirements applied to heterosexuals?

6) Can a gay person become and remain OT 8 in good standing without being required to be celibate, without being required to eventually become heterosexual, and while continuing to have gay sex subject only to the same ethical requirements applied to heterosexuals?

7) Can a gay person become and remain a staff member of AOGP in good standing without being required to be celibate, without being required to eventually become heterosexual, and while continuing to have gay sex subject only to the same ethical requirements applied to heterosexuals?

8) Can a gay person become and remain a member of the clergy of AOGP in good standing without being required to be celibate, without being required to eventually become heterosexual, and while continuing to have gay sex subject only to the same ethical requirements applied to heterosexuals?

9) Is it TRUE that AOGP does NOT perform, endorse, advocate or accept the validity of any form of gay conversion therapy, or any form of therapy or spiritual practice or technology intended, designed or that has the purpose of changing a gay person's sexual orientation from gay to heterosexual?

[NOTE: Question number 9 (perhaps awkwardly) includes a double negative. I did this so that AOGP will pass as not discriminating against gay and lesbian people if and only if all of the questions are answered "yes." I believe that overall the questionnaire is less confusing that way, and less likely cause question number 9 to be answered inaccurately.]

Can you answer the above questionnaire on behalf of AOGP? If not, can you have someone else do so?