BREAKING NEWS Israel launches 'preemptive strikes' on Iran as Netanyahu vows Jewish state won't be 'victim of a nuclear holocaust' and declares 'speci

This thread is suffering from the Fog of War, LOL. :whistle:

It happens. :yes:

…or perhaps it’s the Fog of Ceasefire? I think maybe it wasn’t so much the 12 Day War as it was the ceasefire that’s to blame.

Two things have happened to drive, not only the left, but also the woke right, completely out of their minds.

1. The stunningly successful, precisely executed, tightly defined, audacious American military strike against Iran’s non-peaceful
nuclear weapons development facilities,

2. …immediately followed by a successful U.S. imposed ceasefire between the warring parties that is holding as I write this.


Tragically however, the Democrat Party, CNN and others have become collateral damage and many have fallen victim in the ensuing media firefight.
Ironically, it was more than the “ceasefire now” crowd could handle, poor dears!
But, miraculously, John Fetterman has SURVIVED!

Oh, and so has the State of Israel.
 
This thread is suffering from the Fog of War, LOL. :whistle:

It happens. :yes:

i learned from the old vets who hung out at my uncle's gun shop, that 'first reports are always wrong' -- so i just don't put much stock in them. and also, that initial claims are often excessively optimistic (another thing i'd think people who've been in cults, would be familiar with).

 
1. The stunningly successful, precisely executed, tightly defined, audacious American military strike against Iran’s non-peaceful
nuclear weapons development facilities,

what success? the GBUs may turn out to fail to bust bunkers, and regardless Iran's nuclear program has just been set back by somewhere between 2 months, and 2 years -- at the most optimistic.

what's the plan for that tomorrow, when Iran could be back to where they were last week?

and what about blowback and unintended consequences, like that Iran -- and other states -- may now decide that the only way to assert their sovereignty is to move to having working nuclear weapons, as the North Koreans did?

 
what success? the GBUs may turn out to fail to bust bunkers, and regardless Iran's nuclear program has just been set back by somewhere between 2 months, and 2 years -- at the most optimistic.

what's the plan for that tomorrow, when Iran could be back to where they were last week?

and what about blowback and unintended consequences, like that Iran -- and other states -- may now decide that the only way to assert their sovereignty is to move to having working nuclear weapons, as the North Koreans did?


The evidence of the success is the ceasefire.
The evidence of the success is the fact that not a single Arab country supports Iran having nuclear weapons.
I could go on, but you seem so hopelessly fact-challenged to an extent that I despair of ever reaching you.
Do you really not understand that a ceasefire is a success? A good thing?
Do you really not comprehend that the chances of a regional peace are improved now?
Iran and its proxies have been defanged to an extent that would’ve been unimaginable until recently.
Sad.
 
The evidence of the success is the ceasefire.
The evidence of the success is the fact that not a single Arab country supports Iran having nuclear weapons.
I could go on, but you seem so hopelessly fact-challenged to an extent that I despair of ever reaching you.
Do you really not understand that a ceasefire is a success? A good thing?
Do you really not comprehend that the chances of a regional peace are improved now?
Iran and its proxies have been defanged to an extent that would’ve been unimaginable until recently.
Sad.

Here's more likely the real story:

CNN Reporter Trashes 'Operation Midnight Hammer,' But Her Story Just Fell Apart

Soon after CNN published its report, the New York Times published a similar piece, also radiating scorching delight in anything that might bring Trump down a peg or two.

Two details, however, immediately undermine not just their “reporting” but also their credibility. (I know, how can something at the rock bottom of believability be undermined? All I can say is that CNN and the NYT found a way.)

First, it turns out that that while that little DIA was top secret, it was also categorized as “low confidence.” For those of you not familiar with the complex inner workings of American spycraft, “low confidence” means the government’s confidence in the intel’s reliability is … low. Gosh, it seems like that’s something that CNN, “The Most Trusted Name in News,” and the New York Times, America’s “paper of record,” might have mentioned. Alas, no. After all, there’s only so much room in a politically motivated hit piece designed to undermine a president whose approval numbers remain high. Adding in those two little words “low confidence” would obviously put both news organizations over their word limits.

The second detail is perhaps more damning. The CNN piece’s byline listed a trio of crack reporters: Natasha Bertrand, Katie Bo Lillis, and Zachary Cohen. That first name might not ring a bell, but it would if we didn’t have to continually keep track of a nearly infinite number of lying journalists.

You see, Natasha Bertrand isn’t just any lying journalist (you can lie by omission just as well as by commission — like when you leave out the words “low confidence” to mislead your readers). She’s the lying journalist who single-handedly launched the widespread suppression of the Hunter Biden laptop story, and she did it three weeks before the 2020 election, arguably helping to steal the election from Trump. We know that because researchers later found that when asked if knowledge of the laptop would have changed their votes, enough Democrats said “yes” that Biden’s lead would have collapsed, swinging the election to Trump.

Bertrand was the Politico reporter who published the infamous 51 former senior intel officials say the Hunter Biden laptop story “has all the classic earmarks of a Russian information operation” letter.

(Smarmier wording could hardly have been used. “All the classic earmarks”? Russian “information”? They made sure to say everything that could protect Hunter without saying anything that could come back to bite themselves. Smarmy.)

And what did the doe-eyed Ms. Bertrand get for helping mislead the entire nation? Shortly after her grand snow job, Forbes plopped Bertrand on their “30 Under 30 2021 Media List.” She did the dirty work the Swamp needed done, and the Swamp duly rewarded her.

The fact that Bertrand was involved and that she, her co-authors, and the Times all managed to leave out the single most relevant part of the DIA report — that it was “low confidence” — should shatter any trust we might have in this reporting.

The question remains, however, what else did they leave out? It turns out the answer is “quite a few things that are extremely relevant,” which they might have learned had they not rushed to print.

Tuesday the New York Post reported that the head of the International Atomic Energy Agency said new satellite photos show additional damage beyond what the agency found in the first batch of satellite photos — presumably the only ones the DIA had access to.

David Albright, founder of the Institute for Science and International Security, knows more about the Iranian nuclear program than most people on the planet will ever know. Tuesday Albright wrote, “One change today, after the completion of the DIA report, is intelligence evidence that more enriched uranium stocks are in the rubble than believed just yesterday.”

Well, that undermines the reported DIA claim that Iran’s enriched uranium stockpile was mostly intact.

Albright continued, “Damage to Iran’s three known enrichment facilities, the destruction of Iran’s centrifuge manufacturing capabilities, its uranium conversion facility, uranium metal production plant, and other facilities involved in its nuclear weaponization process, reconstituting these capabilities will take significant time, investment, and energy to return to its previous state before the war or build nuclear weapons. Iran has likely lost close to 20,000 centrifuges at Natanz and Fordow, creating a major bottleneck in any reconstitution effort. Moreover, there has been considerable damage to Iran’s ability to build the nuclear weapon itself.”

And there goes the DIA’s centrifuge claim.

Albright additionally made the points that negotiations with Iran weren’t going anywhere and that the strikes will further deter Iran.

Insufferably outspoken leftist Cenk Uygur even attacked the DIA report, writing, “There’s a new bulls*** leak about how we didn’t destroy Iran’s facilities enough. That means Israel is not done with this war. 99% of the time those types of leaks are either fake intelligence from Israel or a neocon leaking speculative evidence to say we should go back into war.”

Megyn Kelly agreed with Uyger and also offered the idea that the leak could be from someone on the inside who hates Trump. Kelly’s suggestion also squared with Leavitt’s assessment that the leak came from “a loser” in the intel community.
Perhaps the most insightful comments, though, came from Seth Mandel at Commentary.

The only way it is correct to say that Iran would be able now to sprint to a bomb in six months is if nothing else changes. That would mean Israel would be rolling up up its spy network in Iran, would not be patrolling the skies above the country, and the U.S. satellites wouldn’t be watching. It would also mean Iran doing nothing at the bargaining table to satisfy Trump. Perhaps the Iranians will be stubborn and obnoxious. But that won’t mean the Israelis will end their surveillance and stand down forever — and will only encourage the U.S. to supply every piece of intelligence it can garner.

He’s right. Trump went into this saying, “Iran cannot have a nuclear weapon.” The strikes assured that that possibility is farther out of their reach. How far out of reach is a relevant question, but not one that will determine the success of “Operation Midnight Hammer.”

Iran has now been denuded of its defenses, its leaders are literally hiding in caves, its people want to revolt, its terror proxies have been neutralized, its reputation has been diminished to nearly nothing, and it just lost to Donald Trump its last, best bargaining chip — the nearing acquisition of nuclear weapons.

At the same time Israel is safer right now than it has been since its (re)inception in 1947, the “12 Days War” has ended (hopefully), Russia has lost its last regional client, one of China’s largest oil suppliers is in chaos, and both Russia and China are desperately trying and failing to recalibrate every Trump-related scenario they have.

By any — any — measurement “Operation Midnight Hammer” was an astonishing success for Israel, America, and Trump. And ultimately its the success of those three entities that CNN, the New York Times, and the institutional left can’t stand.
 
It appears that the "mostly peaceful" ceasefire is mostly over as Israel attacks Iran AGAIN in a "mostly peaceful" way. :coolwink:
(EDIT: I'm trying to find confirmation of this in other news outlets, but haven't been able to so far)


🚨 BREAKING: Khamenei STUCK In Bunker As Israel Attacks Iran AGAIN
 
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Do you really not comprehend that the chances of a regional peace are improved now?

no, because a lot of expert watchers of the region aren't so sure. for example:


Israel’s War With Iran Has Reordered the Middle East—but Not as Expected
Israel’s military success against Iran undermines one incentive for Saudi normalization and raises concerns about its growing power
Senior Gulf officials are concerned their investment in relations with Washington, including hosting President Trump’s high-profile trip to the Gulf last month, haven’t paid off in influence. Trump’s repeated encouragement of Israel’s attacks and threats against Iran’s supreme leader made them fear a wider war.

and Iran and other nations may now conclude that the only way to protect themselves is to move forward with developing capabilities to be able to hit back at the US itself, adding to the rogue nation threat already posted by North Korea:

 

no, 'significantly’ neutralised' is not in any way equivalent to 'obliterated'.

nor is 'set back years' -- still leaving the problem of what happens down the road, whether that assessment is overly optimistic and is just months as in some others, and regardless what happens with now out of control but almost surely surviving enriched uranium, and processing equipment such as in new and deeper secret sites that likely survived.


i was pretty young then, but i still remember things like this from the post 9/11 war/s -- and think there's a lesson to be learned from them, particularly when it comes to how we theorize about and deal with the Middle East.

who else remembers triumphal language from a blustery leader, that did not turn out so well?

2003 (before the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd battles for Fallujah):

President Bush Announces Major Combat Operations in Iraq Have Ended
In the battle of Iraq, the United States and our allies have prevailed.

2025:

 
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no, 'significantly’ neutralised' is not in any way equivalent to 'obliterated'.

nor is 'set back years' -- still leaving the problem of what happens down the road, whether that assessment is overly optimistic and is just months as in some others, and regardless what happens with now out of control but almost surely surviving enriched uranium, and processing equipment such as in new and deeper secret sites that likely survived.


i was pretty young then, but i still remember things like this from 2003 -- and think there's a lesson to be learned from them, particularly when it comes to how we theorize about and deal with the Middle East.

who else remembers triumphal language from a blustery leader, that did not turn out so well?

2003 (before the 1st, 2nd, and 3rd battles for Fallujah):

President Bush Announces Major Combat Operations in Iraq Have Ended


2025:


Wiped off the face of the Earth:

‘The cumulative achievement allows us to determine that the Iranian nuclear project suffered severe, broad and deep damage and was set back years.’
 
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.
.
what success? the GBUs may turn out to fail to bust bunkers, and regardless Iran's nuclear program has just been set back by somewhere between 2 months and 2 years -- at the most optimistic.

.

That was impressive. I had no idea that you were an elite nuclear physicist who also was certified to do onsite inspections of nuclear facilities. Your absolute certainty that the Iranian program was "set back by somewhere between 2 months and 2 years" is worthy of a Pulitzer Prize in the field of investigative journalism

We have not seen your level of scientifically accurate revelational reportage since (moments before the 2020 Presidential Election) when "51 elite former intelligence officials" all furiously signed a letter testifying that Hunter Biden's laptop was "Russian disinformation".

How were you able to break through the encrypted CIA BDA ("Bomb Damage Assessment") and gain access to the photos and inspection reports by deep cover Mossad agents working inside Iran---in order for you alone to discover such precise timetables ("2 months!") that Iran could rebuild their atomic weapons program?

Do try to hold your shit together because you have drifted out of the lane called "reality" and "I don't know" into the exciting lane reserved for delusionally woke clown "investigative reporters" like Whoopi Goldberg, Rosie O'Donnell, Maxine Waters and the infallibly prophetic Nostradamus of our times, AOC!

"The world is going to end in 12 years
if we don't address climate change!"

—AOC (2019)


* * * * TRIGGER WARNING * * * *
THE FOLLOWING DEPARTMENT OF DEFENSE
MILITARY BRIEFING MAY CONTAIN ACTUAL FACTS




.​
 
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On the subject of how lying, looting leftists use an entire warchest of rhetorical gimmicks
to diminish, degrade & defame any accomplishment of President Trump, no matter how
extraordinary---here is a perfect showcase of how leftist loon Bernie Sanders dodges
and weaves and distracts anyone who dares to question him. Sanders has been
practicing this political legerdemain for so many decades he can now slickly
slime his way out of any "gotcha moments" by pirouetting into piety.

- - -




..​
 
Your absolute certainty that the Iranian program was "set back by somewhere between 2 months and 2 years" is worthy of a Pulitzer Prize in the field of investigative journalism

that's just a citation of the range of reports from the most credible sources, like the DIA and the Israelis -- which i have already linked references to. but here's a piece that sort of summarizes what you might have missed. the Israeli sources quoted here are cautious to pessimistic (note again that assessments like 'inoperable' are by no means equivalent to 'obliterated'):

Iran says nuclear sites ‘badly damaged’ amid conflicting reports on strikes’ success

do you have some source to cite that has equal or greater credibility -- and access to information -- that has an estimation outside of that range?

and i'm not the only one seeing possible 'earlier, similars':

 
that's just a citation of the range of reports from the most credible sources, like the DIA and the Israelis -- which i have already linked references to. but here's a piece that sort of summarizes what you might have missed. the Israeli sources quoted here are cautious to pessimistic (note again that assessments like 'inoperable' are by no means equivalent to 'obliterated'):

Iran says nuclear sites ‘badly damaged’ amid conflicting reports on strikes’ success

do you have some source to cite that has equal or greater credibility -- and access to information -- that has an estimation outside of that range?

and i'm not the only one seeing possible 'earlier, similars':

aa


There are plentiful credible sources other than the NEVER TRUMP NAYSAYERS trying to discount, spin-to-worsen or negate anything that could possibly burnish Trump's popularity.

Here's an example: How about a hotshot military pilot that professionally trained in and flew fighter planes that dropped BBB (Big Beautiful Bombs)--- and performed hundreds if not thousands of pre-flight advanced computer MODELING of the optimized weapons systems that were required to take out the target. That makes him a world class expert on bomb damage analysis, before, during and after a mission.


​
That's why your posting that the damage from of the bunker-busters might only be "2 months" is a curated selection from the vast amount of information out there about the likely condition of the 3 nuclear sites that were hit. You stated it as fact. A more reasonable answer would have been to admit that you personally HAVE NO IDEA since you are not privy to the top secret studies and recon images. Nor are you briefed by the actual military experts that have planned and pulled off this bombing raid --the planning which began decades ago in utter stealth secrecy. The Iranians didn't even know that the IDF and MOSSAD had boots on the ground INSIDE IRAN with weapons and rocketry that would be used, if and once the war between Israel and Iran ever happened. So you have zero clue of what is happening there and have no basis to make such uninformed conclusions.

i don't know the results either but at least I would source information from actual USA bomber pilots and put such source higher on the list than anyone claiming that all those massive MOPs might have only cost the Iranians "2 weeks" of lost time. That's just absurd.

Since Trump first entered politics and ran for his first presidency, there has been a never-ending wave of negative propaganda, gaslighting and "Big Lies" perpetrated against his successes, in order to degrade or destroy his popularity. We could list many dozens of such black psy-ops campaigns. In every one of those fanatical attacks vs. Trump's "wins" the media and deep state intelligence operatives' lie factories burned at full speed 24 hours a day, 7 days a week since 2016.

It's no wonder with that never-ending tsunami of hate/fear driven lies that people end up SEEING and FEELING Trump's "literally worse than Hitler" behavior. In their mind's eye and physiologically they are experiencing "real things" happening. Yes, they are real things in their mind and with enough of those triggers they end up being pulled downstream with all the other millions of TDS afflicted fish in that river, which finally dumps out into a toxic ocean densely populated with Mass Psychogenic Hysteria (e.g. "Trump is an agent of Putin!"; "If Trump is elected he will crash the stock market and the entire economy!"; "Trump called white supremecists and neo-Nazis very fine people!"; "Trump is literally worse than Hitler!!"; "Trump was convicted of rape!"; "Trump is using the Presidency to get rich and destroy our democracy!" "Trump is a fascist dictator who will never leave the White House!" "Trump hates blacks, hispanics and jews and is trying to genocide them!" et al. . . . . . )

It's not even that many of the TDS-afflicted are making it up or "delusional". They can actually SEE what they think they are seeing. There are many such examples as you would likely know where two individuals looking at the identical thing an "see" completely different things. It's a remarkable capability of the human brain to (in certain situations) INTERPRET or even "COMPLETE" partial information (very much like AI would be able to do). In "completing" or "interpreting" an image, for example, both parties could even see a different color dress. . .

WHAT COLOR IS THIS DRESS?

The_dress_blueblackwhitegold.jpg


WHITE & GOLD ?
or
BLUE & BLACK?

link to wiki article on viral illusion

here is the same dress. . .
Untitled-12.jpg


article:
HERE IS WHY NO ONE AGREES ON THE COLOR OF THE DRESS

..
​
 
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aa


There are plentiful credible sources other than the NEVER TRUMP NAYSAYERS trying to discount, spin-to-worsen or negate anything that could possibly burnish Trump's popularity.

Here's an example: How about a hotshot military pilot that professionally trained in and flew fighter planes that dropped BBB (Big Beautiful Bombs)--- and performed hundreds if not thousands of pre-flight advanced computer MODELING of the optimized weapons systems that were required to take out the target. That makes him a world class expert on bomb damage analysis, before, during and after a mission.


​
That's why your posting that the damage from of the bunker-busters might only be "2 months" is a curated selection from the vast amount of information out there about the likely condition of the 3 nuclear sites that were hit. You stated it as fact. A more reasonable answer would have been to admit that you personally HAVE NO IDEA since you are not privy to the top secret studies and recon images. Nor are you briefed by the actual military experts that have planned and pulled off this bombing raid --the planning which began decades ago in utter stealth secrecy. The Iranians didn't even know that the IDF and MOSSAD had boots on the ground INSIDE IRAN with weapons and rocketry that would be used, if and once the war between Israel and Iran ever happened. So you have zero clue of what is happening there and have no basis to make such uninformed conclusions.

i don't know the results either but at least I would source information from actual USA bomber pilots and put such source higher on the list than anyone claiming that all those massive MOPs might have only cost the Iranians "2 weeks" of lost time. That's just absurd.

Since Trump first entered politics and ran for his first presidency, there has been a never-ending wave of negative propaganda, gaslighting and "Big Lies" perpetrated against his successes, in order to degrade or destroy his popularity. We could list many dozens of such black psy-ops campaigns. In every one of those fanatical attacks vs. Trump's "wins" the media and deep state intelligence operatives' lie factories burned at full speed 24 hours a day, 7 days a week since 2016.

It's no wonder with that never-ending tsunami of hate/fear driven lies that people end up SEEING and FEELING Trump's "literally worse than Hitler" behavior. In their mind's eye and physiologically they are experiencing "real things" happening. Yes, they are real things in their mind and with enough of those triggers they end up being pulled downstream with all the other millions of TDS afflicted fish in that river, which finally dumps out into a toxic ocean densely populated with Mass Psychogenic Hysteria (e.g. "Trump is an agent of Putin!"; "If Trump is elected he will crash the stock market and the entire economy!"; "Trump called white supremecists and neo-Nazis very fine people!"; "Trump is literally worse than Hitler!!"; "Trump was convicted of rape!"; "Trump is using the Presidency to get rich and destroy our democracy!" "Trump is a fascist dictator who will never leave the White House!" "Trump hates blacks, hispanics and jews and is trying to genocide them!" et al. . . . . . )

It's not even that many of the TDS-afflicted are making it up or "delusional". They can actually SEE what they think they are seeing. There are many such examples as you would likely know where two individuals looking at the identical thing an "see" completely different things. It's a remarkable capability of the human brain to (in certain situations) INTERPRET or even "COMPLETE" partial information (very much like AI would be able to do). In "completing" or "interpreting" an image, for example, both parties could even see a different color dress. . .

WHAT COLOR IS THIS DRESS?

The_dress_blueblackwhitegold.jpg


WHITE & GOLD ?
or
BLUE & BLACK?

link to wiki article on viral illusion

here is the same dress. . .
Untitled-12.jpg


article:
HERE IS WHY NO ONE AGREES ON THE COLOR OF THE DRESS

..
​

Here's what we know...

No armchair rabid feminist know-it-all is ever going to be other than pessimistic.

That's ALL it ever is. An incessant piss on the parade of life. There are absolutely no silver linings - all there ever is is a life-sucking pall of gloom.

What do we know?

The head of Mossad makes a rare public statement of this:

severe, broad and deep damage and was set back years.

These are the people that have everything riding on this...the most to lose...the most to gain. If there was any doubt at all this would've never saw print or the light of day. Instead, they would be calling for more strikes.
 
🚨 BREAKING: Israel Prepares To End Ceasefire With Iran
 
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