Was LRH CIA?

SuperstarNeilC

Well-known member

Honestly, L. Ron Hubbard might have been involved with the CIA and/or naval intelligence while he was doing Scientology. In this series of briefings I lay out all the reasons why this might have been the case. Personally I believe he was, but just cant say for sure, not enough evidence has come out yet.
 

Karakorum

Well-known member
He was just a race car driver from a different planet.
 

Bill

Well-known member
Honestly, L. Ron Hubbard might have been involved with the CIA and/or naval intelligence while he was doing Scientology. In this series of briefings I lay out all the reasons why this might have been the case. Personally I believe he was, but just cant say for sure, not enough evidence has come out yet.
You may not understand this whole "LRH was Naval Intelligence" thing. This was created by the Church of Scientology to explain why what Hubbard claimed he did in the war didn't match what the official documents proved he didn't do.

The more realistic explanation was: Hubbard lied, just like he lied about everything else.

He wasn't in Naval Intelligence. It is highly doubtful Hubbard was involved with the CIA since they labeled him "seems mental" IIRC.
 

ILove2Lurk

Lisbeth Salander
Fantasy prone personality (FPP)
A disposition or personality trait in which a person experiences a lifelong extensive
and deep involvement in fantasy. This disposition is an attempt, at least in part, to
better describe "overactive imagination" or "living in a dream world."
¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 

Veda

Well-known member
During the mid 1970s, Lyndon LaRouche's organization published a detailed report that claimed that Scientology was a product of MK-ULTRA.

According to the LaRouche people, other products of MK-ULTRA were rock music, the Beatles, and Star Trek.

*​

There was a pattern, for Hubbard, to hear or read something, or have a brush with something, then craft a tale with himself a central player.

For example, before dropping out, he was student for a year at George Washington University, where he had a class in molecular and atomic physics, which he flunked. From this Hubbard presented himself as one of the first atomic physicists, sought after by governments and government agencies, for his expertise in atomic physics.

Hubbard's second wife decided to divorce him. She was then presented as a victim of "PDH," and then as a Russian agent, or sympathizer, and then, years later - after a shift in public opinion made calling people communists no longer efficacious - as a Nazi agent. Link to the Hubbard's Propaganda Tech thread.

Hubbard was in the Navy, where he had an unremarkable record, and saw no actual combat. From this he presented himself as a wounded war hero.

Hubbard bragged about having been at a high level in Naval Intelligence, which was strange as, usually such a thing would be kept quiet. His records showed that he was a lowly cable censor which, technically, is "Naval Intelligence," but not at all glamorous.



Hubbard obtained a lot of his information at informal gatherings and during conversations. According to his second wife, Sara (who had been a fan or the writings of Alfred Korzybski, as were many others during that period), Hubbard didn't read much Korzybski but learned through conversing.

Back to the topic of Hubbard mentioning MK-Ultra during a lecture of the 1960s, his former Dianetic preclear, Aldous Huxley, has been accused of being one of three intelligence agents who were research directors for MK-Ultra. Is there any truth to that? Who knows? But it would fit the pattern for Hubbard to have heard something, then present himself as having been a big inside player.

Hubbard was not a hero, nor a 007 character.




Edit: fitness report added.
 

PirateAndBum

Administrator
Staff member
He was way too busy saving mankind for the next trillion years. No time to work for the CIA. Given his troubles with governments and his paranoia I would find it hard to believe he would be in bed with the CIA.
 

Reyne Mayer

Pansexual Revolutionary
He was way too busy saving mankind for the next trillion years. No time to work for the CIA. Given his troubles with governments and his paranoia I would find it hard to believe he would be in bed with the CIA.
yep.

the FBI labeled him a 'mental case' -- with good reason given the crazy letters he was sending them about things like people trying to kill him in the middle of the night and commie agents hiding behind every potted plant, which i suspect were partly drug-induced (the meth-like stimulants such as benzedrine he seems to have been doing at the time, can cause/exacerbate paranoia). that's not the sort of person agencies recruit, or trust.

i wouldn't be surprised if intelligence agencies did take note of what Hubbard was doing, and sent someone competent in to evaluate whether there might be something to be learned from it. similarly i suspect the remote viewing research, that some scientologists were involved in, was a sort of due dilligence effort by the government just to be sure there wasn't anything to what the Russians were also looking in to (in part because they had a regime inclined to go down pseudoscience rabbit holes, driven by ideology, authoritarianism and practices oddly similar to scientology in some ways).
 

Reyne Mayer

Pansexual Revolutionary
There was a pattern, for Hubbard, to hear or read something, or have a brush with something, then craft a tale with himself a central player.
yep. also, i have noticed there are typically kernels of truth in his various autobiographical accounts and tales, then spun into fabulistic accounts with him playing that sort of grandiose role.

for example his stays at various hospitals, malingering in VA ones and then probably as a patient in a program for troubled veterns in Savannah, turned into claims and stories of 'research' working with patients -- though i don't doubt he probably experimented with amateur psychotherapy and hypnosis, on his fellow inmates.

his followers and organization do similar things, blowing small bits of truth out of proportion.
 

freethinker

Controversial
Not referring to peeling off the onion layers. Referring to "Was LRH CIA?" As if that is a legitimate question. Did I offend?
He doesn't get you were referring to the publication, The Onion.
 

Reyne Mayer

Pansexual Revolutionary
I think they would have seen him as too much of a nutbag to be an asset.

More likely an extreme liability.
yeah, and besides the FBI's judgment of his paranoid ravings qualifying him as 'mental case' his superiors in the Navy didn't think much better of him either:

This officer [is] lacking in the essential qualities of judgment, leadership and cooperation. He acts without forethought as to probable results.
- Rear Admiral F.A. Braisted, July 15, 1943​

i'd say that qualifies him as the sort of person they might exploit as an asset if it were expedient, the way law enforcement for instance uses often unreliable criminals and addicts as informants and in entrapment stings, but not actually trust as some sort of real operative or agent.
 

The_Fixer

Well-known member
yeah, and besides the FBI's judgment of his paranoid ravings qualifying him as 'mental case' his superiors in the Navy didn't think much better of him either:

This officer [is] lacking in the essential qualities of judgment, leadership and cooperation. He acts without forethought as to probable results.
- Rear Admiral F.A. Braisted, July 15, 1943​

i'd say that qualifies him as the sort of person they might exploit as an asset if it were expedient, the way law enforcement for instance uses often unreliable criminals and addicts as informants and in entrapment stings, but not actually trust as some sort of real operative or agent.
That Admiral's comment describes a typical sociopathic trait. It's a guess, but I don't think that it was well known as a marker for the condition back then. Maybe the psychs did, but not the general public, although many would have known something was odd about him.

I agree with you that the CIA could possibly used him as a tool, but not a reliable asset and definitely not agent material.
 

Xenu Xenu Xenu

Well-known member
I remember when wacko enthusiastic Scieno cult cheerleaders were telling me that Fatboy Ron had been given a title by the Pope. I don't know if this was an attempt to start a rumour which would hopefully stick as the truth within Scientology circles, or just the typical insane shit that the "uptone" Scientologists always get up to.
 
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