Wanting out and the fear of Disconnection.

Olifay

Member
Hi. I have been thinking and hoping I would have the balls to do this eventually, so here I am. I am a second-generation Scientologist, currently approaching or starting my 30s (keeping it vague :p). I joined the SO and subsequently left three times. First, at the cadet org at 8, leaving the base at 13. Then, 16 until 18, and finally my one year stint at 20. Needless to say, I was not very on-purpose!
I would be glad to go into further details of this part of my life in later posts if there is interest. The purpose of my current post is, I need advice or at least a verbal kick in the butt.
Even though I did leave the Sea Org and have not really been at an Org since, my close family is comprised only of true, passionate believers. It kept my chained to the thought patterns and basic beliefs a long time. I had never, until very recently, even dared look up anything online. I heard about the shows, but you tend to keep that to yourself and try to not get further in, for fear of being found.
Then, I started reading Mike and Tony’s blog. I have always hated what happened with my life, the lack of choice I had, and always kept it to myself. I also justified this by telling myself I was probably the exception, not the rule. I had seen other young SO go in, and stay in and to this day they seem very happy. My siblings are SO members, almost 30 yrs strong each. And so, reading the stories of others who went though similar, or worse situations, it clicked. This place was hell. And I now saw it was designed to be.
So, I am now renting a room from one of those Scientologist family members, reading all this stuff I am not supposed to. And I am at a point where I don’t know if I can go through leaving for real, as I know I need to, so I can start making a real me.
I know that just posting this has its risks. If I was to finally tell my family what I truly thought, they would have to make a choice. And it would destroy my parents. And it’s hard. But I don’t think I can just “get past it” and go on quietly, as if they had done nothing wrong. Please, AITA for forcing this choice on them, knowingly?

Sorry, this is a long post, and I wrote it as I was thinking, so maybe a little incoherent? I don’t write much.

TL.DR: Is it okay to knowingly destroy your own family because of this group’s policies?

Thanks. A person wanting to leave.
(How hard is clicking that post thread button)
 

stratty

Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband
I was just about to go to bed (I'm in England) when I saw your post and saw nobody had responded for at least twenty minutes. You did well pressing that post button, so if I don't say much else, there is that. Make sure you cover your tracks if you're using a shared computer where you're living. I'm sure others will come forward with good advice for you very soon.

stratty.
 

Dotey OT

Dis-Membered
One thing that I have noticed, is that my ideas and attitudes have changed quite a bit over time. I have been out just over three years. I was in for almost 30, and had been on class V org staff. I had a bunch invested in the thing, had a divorce and you name it.

I am still connected and under the radar. Being UTR, causes all kinds of stress and indigestion. Sometimes I think I would be better off fully disconnected, but other times It's ok to remain slightly connected. I hear something said by one of my friends that are still in and I get pissed how badly they are being ripped off. Then I try to talk an old friend out and he threatens to write me up. I try to recover some other old friends, and they stop taking my calls and they are no longer friends.

It gets better though. I don't go a day where I'm not thankful that I am free of that trap!
 

Olifay

Member
I was just about to go to bed (I'm in England) when I saw your post and saw nobody had responded for at least twenty minutes. You did well pressing that post button, so if I don't say much else, there is that. Make sure you cover your tracks if you're using a shared computer where you're living. I'm sure others will come forward with good advice for you very soon.

stratty.
Thanks. That means a lot. It was hard indeed! I do all this in my phone, so their network is safe. No entheta will enter the router. (It feels so good to be able to say what I want to say). Makes me think ‘someone’ should make a filter web extension or something for public?
is it bad to give them ideas on here? Maybe for potential a-e (haha) amends? Thanks again.
 

Olifay

Member
One thing that I have noticed, is that my ideas and attitudes have changed quite a bit over time. I have been out just over three years. I was in for almost 30, and had been on class V org staff. I had a bunch invested in the thing, had a divorce and you name it.

I am still connected and under the radar. Being UTR, causes all kinds of stress and indigestion. Sometimes I think I would be better off fully disconnected, but other times It's ok to remain slightly connected. I hear something said by one of my friends that are still in and I get pissed how badly they are being ripped off. Then I try to talk an old friend out and he threatens to write me up. I try to recover some other old friends, and they stop taking my calls and they are no longer friends.

It gets better though. I don't go a day where I feel free of that trap!
Hi. I get you. And I’m kind of lucky, because I have been able to be critical in the past to them, blowing off steam, because they can handle it. My personal family is pretty much all still SO. And I’ve tried to rely on them to give me advice, but I see now that no matter what, it will always get to ‘get back on lines’, and not in a forceful way but because they believe it is the only thing that can help me. And I’m sick of it. I don’t have friends, because every time someone got close to knowing me, I shut them off, because I was afraid they would find out about who I was.
And, holy shit, am I glad I posted here. I haven’t felt like I was able to talk in so long. Thanks so much.
Edit: not NO friend sorry. It’s not true. My best and longest friends though are Scientologists. Can’t talk to them about this. The rest, I’ve discarded, as stated above. I’m mostly scared I’ll hurt them, or worse, that they would pity me.
 

UTR

Celestial Spork
You are not alone.

I have family who are still in, and I try to maintain a friendly relationship with them so that if they ever need help, they know they can turn to me.

I'm sure you already know how delicate things can be when you have a living situation that is closely tied to Scientologists. Be safe.

Rest assured, you aren't imagining the bad things you've seen while you were in, you aren't crazy, you're not alone, and we are here for you.
 

Veda

Well-known member
Hi. I have been thinking and hoping I would have the balls to do this eventually, so here I am. I am a second-generation Scientologist, currently approaching or starting my 30s (keeping it vague :p). I joined the SO and subsequently left three times. First, at the cadet org at 8, leaving the base at 13. Then, 16 until 18, and finally my one year stint at 20. Needless to say, I was not very on-purpose!
I would be glad to go into further details of this part of my life in later posts if there is interest. The purpose of my current post is, I need advice or at least a verbal kick in the butt.
Even though I did leave the Sea Org and have not really been at an Org since, my close family is comprised only of true, passionate believers. It kept my chained to the thought patterns and basic beliefs a long time. I had never, until very recently, even dared look up anything online. I heard about the shows, but you tend to keep that to yourself and try to not get further in, for fear of being found.
Then, I started reading Mike and Tony’s blog. I have always hated what happened with my life, the lack of choice I had, and always kept it to myself. I also justified this by telling myself I was probably the exception, not the rule. I had seen other young SO go in, and stay in and to this day they seem very happy. My siblings are SO members, almost 30 yrs strong each. And so, reading the stories of others who went though similar, or worse situations, it clicked. This place was hell. And I now saw it was designed to be.
So, I am now renting a room from one of those Scientologist family members, reading all this stuff I am not supposed to. And I am at a point where I don’t know if I can go through leaving for real, as I know I need to, so I can start making a real me.
I know that just posting this has its risks. If I was to finally tell my family what I truly thought, they would have to make a choice. And it would destroy my parents. And it’s hard. But I don’t think I can just “get past it” and go on quietly, as if they had done nothing wrong. Please, AITA for forcing this choice on them, knowingly?

Sorry, this is a long post, and I wrote it as I was thinking, so maybe a little incoherent? I don’t write much.

TL.DR: Is it okay to knowingly destroy your own family because of this group’s policies?

Thanks. A person wanting to leave.
(How hard is clicking that post thread button)
Hi Olifay. Welcome.

Scientology existed for fifteen years before the Sea Org was begun.

Hubbard created the Sea Org at the same time that he made himself the "Commodore," in 1967, and invented "Incident 2" of OT 3 (and Xenu, etc.) as the explanation to himself, and others, for his nervous breakdown (depicted as his confronting and "mapping" of a super engram), after his failures in Southern Africa in 1966. (Hubbard thought he was the reincarnation of Cecil Rhodes and had been expecting to "glow" his way into mass acceptance and popularity in southern Africa.)

With his invented "explanation" for his disappointments in southern Africa firmly established as "reality" and "tech," Hubbard rebounded from his depression until July 1977 when his secret spying and dirty tricks activities and instructions were exposed. This led to Hubbard going into deep hiding and his wife taking the rap for him and, ultimately, being sentenced to federal prison.

Even then, he once again re-created himself, this time as "one of the greatest fiction authors of all time," and began writing pulp fiction - as a kind of therapy for himself. Scientologists were sent to bookstores to buy stacks of Battlefield Earth (retail), in a given week, to put it on the bestseller list.

Throughout his life, Hubbard would create "reality bubbles," usually to solve some problem or upset he had, and then invite (or trick) people into that reality bubble.

For example, in 1978, Hubbard wanted a drastically increased cash flow, particularly from his franchises (Missions), so he "discovered" Dianetic Clear and told Scientologists there were "Dianetic Clears" all over the place. Almost instantly, thousands of Scientologists wanted to attest to being "Dianetic Clears," where they were applauded and validated, then told they were "at risk" and needed to immediately go "up lines" and begin their very expensive OT levels.

Being engulfed in any one else's "reality bubble" is usually not a good idea, but, for some, it can become "home."

If you're curious about more background for the Sea Org, I suggest reading "Layer Four" in this link to Brainwashing Manual Parallels.

I wish I had some great advice to give you but, off hand, I don't, except hang in there.


 

PirateAndBum

Administrator
Staff member
If you publicly disavow Scn your family and scn friends will disconnect from you. You need to weigh the pros and cons carefully. Take your time, there's no rush.

Start making non-scn friends. Don't worry about what they will think about your history with scn. If you're working for a scn-run company look for a new job among the "wogs".
 

The Oracle

Not the same Oracle from a decade ago
Welcome. I am happy you are here. You will figure out what is best for you. Welcome out of that sticky trap. I commend you for having enough ability to see the truth about Scientology. We all cringe about our involvement. Well, most of us do. Let me know, at anytime, if I can give u support. The aftermath Foundation gives those wishing to get out and need support - real, honest help with no strings attached.
 

onceuponatime

Well-known member
I've never been in but have family who are. Do you have extended family members you can reach out to? You don't have to come right out and tell them you're leaving Scientology, but you can at least start reconnecting with them. Could give you some base to start from. I guarantee your extended family, even if they aren't saying anything regarding Scientology, will support your leaving.

I also agree with the earlier post saying gradual is probably best. Make non Scientology friends, get a non Scientology job, etc. If you "come out" to your family and friends you have to accept that they will probably turn their back on you.

Good luck!
 

Incognito

Member
Welcome. I am newly out...2 years and I can't also give much detail but I did it all wrong. I started spouting off to my partner about the abuse I read about, it being a cult and Dianetics being hypnotic and I really was all over the place in terms of expressing myself coherently...and basically partner walked out and told enough people including family to cause widespread disconnection from me...partner still trying to get me to see I've be brainwashed by the anti cult. I avoid any more discussion on it as they always have an answer...I'm pts got mus out list etc etc. And I've been asked for the worst thing I've read on line but I have not fallen For the bait because I do not know the consequences...if I spread 'entheta'. I have kids to consider and its still a huge dilemma. But I am seen as pretty much the devil for going on this forum and following Leah remini etc. I have connected with a few UTR ex members and one is not UTR and has spoken out on the media but not to friends and so they don't know. This person also managed to get their family out over a long time by getting them to question things. But eveyone is different. My ex partner is ok with the idea miscavidge hit people and people who attack Scientology are attached back. Etc. Some people are top hard to crack ...my only advice is take your time and stay UTR and move away and slowly if you feel you want to try and sow seeds of doubt. My ex partners family all disconnected plus friends but if I bumped into anyost would acknowledge me but not stop to chat. A couple actually look at me with fear or hate. Not nice. And I can't move away ....
 

Dark

Well-known member
whatever is true about spirituality, the red headed money parasite did not invent it.
God did, by whatever name.
the mediocre science fiction writer copy machined wisdom from buddhism and other ancient wisdom and pretended he invented it.
run away.
 

marra

Well-known member
There is a well-known writer called Neil Gaiman who is from a very prominent UK Scientology family but he managed to get out and now is not a Scientologist but still maintains contact with his family. He is very careful not to say anything bad about Scientology when being interviewed by the media and that is why his family is still allowed to be in contact with him. If you go quietly then there shouldn't be a major problem.

Edit: Funnily enough, on Mike Rinder's blog today he posted an HCO Ethics Order written personally by LRH in 1968 wherein he declared Neil Gaiman's great aunt, Freda Gaiman, to be an "enemy of mankind".

 
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HelluvaHoax!

Well-known member
If you publicly disavow Scn your family and scn friends will disconnect from you. You need to weigh the pros and cons carefully. Take your time, there's no rush.

Start making non-scn friends. Don't worry about what they will think about your history with scn. If you're working for a scn-run company look for a new job among the "wogs".
.

That advice is worth gold to anyone trying to escape the cult's toxic gravity!

It might sound extreme, but my own personal experience has proven that it's best to NOT RELY ON SCIENTOLOGISTS FOR ANYTHING YOU NEED TO SUCCEED AND SURIVE (jobs, money, loans, living accommodations, transportation, advice, help, et al).

The truth is that you cannot count on any true-believing Scientologist to not cut you off and/or stab you in the back---if their church tells them it's "pro-survival" to do so.

I'd also give advice to someone new in a jungle not to walk barefoot because there are poisonous snakes, spiders and scorpions.

Olifay, you did really great to start your full escape. Life is incredibly better the further you distance yourself from Hubbard's horrific hoax. Keep goin!


.
 

HelluvaHoax!

Well-known member
.

Hard rules about the hard truth of leaving Hubbard's cult:

- - - If you are in a relationship or married to a Scientologist, you are also married to Scientology. In that case, both you and your significant other are on the "command channel" and Hubbard and Miscavige are your infallible bosses. Just accept it and hang photos of them on your walls so you can stand and applaud whenever they give you an order.
- - - If you work for a Scientologist, you also work for Scientology. They are your boss even if the owner of the company is not a staff member.
- - - If you have close friends who are Scientologists, you are being surveilled just like Winston Smith in Orwell's book "1984". At any moment you might well be reported to the "thought police" by means of a Knowledge Report.
- - - If you have association with Scientologists, EXPECT them to try to "HANDLE" you. Scientologists compulsively feel the obsession and desperate need to handle everyone else.


If you don't mind the above, you can have as many Scientologists in your life as you like. Hey, everyone is different, some people can walk on water!

Personally, that would make me go completely nuts---which is why I blew. LOL.


.
 
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Irayam

Well-known member
Hi Olifay,
Welcome to this forum!
You made the right decision by leaving, it takes courage. Even I, who wasn't staff and didn't have a family in Scientology, knew I was going to lose all my friends.
PirateAndBum's advice is important. Take your time and think about it, read as much as you can about it and learn from those who have gone down the same path as you did.
 

Dotey OT

Dis-Membered
.

Hard rules about the hard truth of leaving Hubbard's cult:

- - - If you are in a relationship or married to a Scientologist, you are also married to Scientology. In that case, both you and your significant other are on the "command channel" and Hubbard and Miscavige are your infallible bosses. Just accept it and hang photos of them on your walls so you can stand and applaud whenever they give you an order.
- - - If you work for a Scientologist, you also work for Scientology. They are your boss even if the owner of the company is not a staff member.
- - - If you have close friends who are Scientologists, you are being surveilled just like George Winston in Orwell's book "1984". At any moment you might well be reported to the "thought police" by means of a Knowledge Report.
- - - If you have association with Scientologists, EXPECT them to try to "HANDLE" you. Scientologists compulsively feel the obsession and desperate need to handle everyone else.


If you don't mind the above, you can have as many Scientologists in your life as you like. Hey, everyone is different, some people can walk on water!

Personally, that would make me go completely nuts---which is why I blew. LOL.


.
I am so lucky to have gotten out with my significant other. It was never in question, at least to her. I did not know that. I still work for a scamatologist, a good guy but he is under pressure from ethics since he is trying to make his way up the bridge. As a result, I had to meet with an MAA and maneuver my way through those wickets. Never a dull moment!!
 
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