TRUST

Karen#1

Well-known member
Is there anything more important in any relationship ?

I have been reflecting on what occurs as a commonality between each and every EX who departed the cult.
The nonsense that we all had CRIMES and OVERTS was debunked by Bill Franks in the communication he had from Hubbard, I will re-post it in comments.

I think the bedrock basic in any relationship is TRUST. Not just romantic relationships, but business relationships, relationships with one's religion, one's club, one's favorite internet board, facebook group ANY relationship. You count on someone because you have belief in them and then when they SNAP and act totally contrary to what you have believed them to be, TRUST is broken and the relationship is on a path to ending.

In the Sea org, all of us believed in it all, but we also were bamboozled into thinking management, senior Execs up the food chain were decent human beings. So suddenly atrocities in terms of unconscionable punishments are doled out. TRUST is shattered. I believe this is the one thing in in common with everyone of us who left.

TRUST was shattered. TRUST meant to us CONFIDENCE. But the opposite of TRUST ~~ distrust is suspicion
One day at INT Base I was hauled in for more security questions where I was asked if
1) I had been sent into the cult by the FBI
2) If I had been implanted by some drug at the dentist and unknown commands were implanted in my head.
3)If I intended to flee and go to the Los Angeles Times/IRS with my story
and other BIZARRE and off the wall questions getting more and more off the wall to the point of utter insanity.

Remember, at this time in my life I was a totally loyal dedicated Sea org member. I was in the MATRIX. Nothing could have been further from my mind than fleeing to the FBI !

My trust of the group I had signed up to belong to was now in crisis mode. This was not MY GROUP ~ these were some whacko lunatics who were adverserial. What was their motive ? What was the intent ?

It was the beginning of the end for me. It was a matter of time before I was done with my billion year contract.TRUST.jpg
The start of my 6 month imprisonment and sec checking was that I had said something I should not have said. No need to bring the hammer down. I could have been handled for my great *sin* a sit down and talking to. Not only did Miscavige and his thugs no longer inspire TRUST, they acted in a way which shattered TRUST.

I had an experience years and years ago which made me gain some new awareness on TRUST. I was flying back East to testify in an Art Fraud Law suit. $40 million dollar fraud, I was the Thomas Kinkade expert witness on Kinkade fraud.

This was while I was still IN the cult, out of the Sea Org, but in "good standing." I needed to leave my car at the airport and I had no idea when I would return. I looked up various airport long term parking as inexpensive as $12 a day, so I latched on to one.

Trials have a lot of variables. I had no idea when I would be back. When I arrived at this advertised parking lot, I could not BELIEVE it. It was nothing more than some patch of wilderness, wild grass over flat land. The nice helpful man who greeted me barely spoke English and signaled to me where to pull in. It was tight to catch my plane, I gave him $100 to cover plenty of days and handed over the keys to my ACURA. As I ran to catch the plane I realized what I had done. I had given a complete stranger the keys to my high end luxury car and $100. I thought to myself, I am likely never to see my car again.

I had so many urges to return to retrieve my car, but I could not turn back at the risk of missing my flight pre-paid by the Federal Prosecutors who expected my arrival By the time I was on the ramp as I felt more and more rattled as to what I had done.
TRUST. There was no TRUST
(Oh well I am fully insured I thought. Story ends that when I came back from South Carolina, my Acura was right there. My distrust was unfounded.)
But I tell the tale because TRUST is a huge big deal for me. I am of the opinion that PRIOR to any of us departing the CULT, it was TRUST that got violated. Of course we learn more and more of huge FRAUD and other felonies but this is after the fact.

There are tons of people under the radar in touch with me sharing their stories. They know by my record I am trustworthy hence they share their deepest secrets and even though I am all over social media, never in a million years could I betray that trust. But I am honored that I am so trusted.

Betrayal of TRUST is the end of the road.

Thoughts ?
 
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Type4_PTS

Well-known member
For me, after getting SP Declared in 1989 I initially had the intention to go back. I felt if I got a Committee of Evidence as per policy and all the facts were presented, my SP Declare would be lifted easily.

At a certain point I realized that there was zero intent on their part to actually honor any of the LRH policies on justice. Had they done so I'm confident they would have put my Declare through the shredder

The most difficult thing for me to deal with was confronting the magnitude of the betrayal of trust. I hadn't conceived of the possibility that this organization was so far from what I believed it to be. So the betrayal of trust hit me hard.

As I've written on a number of occasions, I'm grateful now that they did handle it that way back at that time. . Although it was very hard in some respects, it also had a number of unintended but very positive consequences. For one, I reconnected with my father and spent lots of time with him in what turned out to be his last year of his life. This was after hardly speaking to him at all for ten years prior due to the damage caused by applying the standard PTS/SP "tech". So this SP Declare was really the greatest gift given to me by the cult.
 

HelluvaHoax!

Well-known member
.

Terrific post Karen!

The subject of "Trust & Betrayal" in Scientology is a fascinating one that deserves this kind of exposure.

As much and cleverly as the cult of Scientology attempts to disguise and hide the sheer avariciousness and sadistic thuggery of its betrayals, it is an impossible task. They simply betray too many people including the most dedicated, generous and trustworthy of their own membership!

In a perversely paradoxical way, Scientology's serial betrayal of others is a "successful action" for them and their parishioners:

-- Scientology's gurus (Commodore/COB) "win" from betraying others because they fraudulently acquire billions of dollars!​
-- Corporate Scientology "wins" by creating a firewall from lawsuits and criminal prosecution by reason of their well publicized "fair game" savagery---making victims and gov't bureaucrats alike too intimidated to consider legal action.​
-- Scientologists "win" big time too, because the toxic wave of destruction that the cult leaves in its wake is far too extensive and extreme for it's own parishioners to ignore---particularly when they find themselves in the crosshairs of ops to "utterly destroy" them! In being so gruesomely obvious about devastating individuals, friends & families, the cult effectively delivers the most valuable (and only) "ability attained" on the entire grade chart---the ability to escape. Total freedom--from the cult.​

As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1"

FINAL NOTE: So many thoughts and memories flooded in while reading your insightful post! Even this wacky but perhaps true realization (sparked by your airport anecdote) that is remarkably reminiscent of Godwin's Law.

GODWIN'S LAW
As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a
comparison involving NAZIS or HITLER approaches 1.

HOAX'S LAW
As an online discussion about Scientology grows longer,
the probability invoking "OT PARKING WINS" approaches 1."


.
 

JustSheila

Well-known member
Over three decades out of the Sea Org and I still trust people too easily, giving them the benefit of the doubt, then get aggravated when they walk all over and abuse me and I have to take action and I hate hate hate hate hate doing that. By then, it takes a real hard kick in the gonzos, and I can kick real hard, but :wtf: ??? Why can't people just act decently in the first place? Why do assholes just walk all over other people? Why the f do I have to show I can kick harder anyway just to protect myself? I don't want to kick anybody, but there you have it.

I see the best in people first. That kind of sucks, because people are a combination. Seeing the best in them seems to give them an excuse to act their worst. They want to be beaten? Okay, there ya go then. I don't get it.

I'm being really sincere here.

Anyone have a better approach? I'm open to it.
 

Karen#1

Well-known member
Over three decades out of the Sea Org and I still trust people too easily, giving them the benefit of the doubt, then get aggravated when they walk all over and abuse me and I have to take action and I hate hate hate hate hate doing that. By then, it takes a real hard kick in the gonzos, and I can kick real hard, but :wtf: ??? Why can't people just act decently in the first place? Why do assholes just walk all over other people? Why the f do I have to show I can kick harder anyway just to protect myself? I don't want to kick anybody, but there you have it.

I see the best in people first. That kind of sucks, because people are a combination. Seeing the best in them seems to give them an excuse to act their worst. They want to be beaten? Okay, there ya go then. I don't get it.

I'm being really sincere here.

Anyone have a better approach? I'm open to it.
Sheila dearest,

I GROK you.

Description
Grok is a neologism coined by American writer Robert A. Heinlein for his 1961 science fiction novel Stranger in a Strange Land
grok :
understand (something) intuitively or by empathy.
 

Karen#1

Well-known member
.

Terrific post Karen!

The subject of "Trust & Betrayal" in Scientology is a fascinating one that deserves this kind of exposure.

As much and cleverly as the cult of Scientology attempts to disguise and hide the sheer avariciousness and sadistic thuggery of its betrayals, it is an impossible task. They simply betray too many people including the most dedicated, generous and trustworthy of their own membership!

In a perversely paradoxical way, Scientology's serial betrayal of others is a "successful action" for them and their parishioners:

-- Scientology's gurus (Commodore/COB) "win" from betraying others because they fraudulently acquire billions of dollars!​
-- Corporate Scientology "wins" by creating a firewall from lawsuits and criminal prosecution by reason of their well publicized "fair game" savagery---making victims and gov't bureaucrats alike too intimidated to consider legal action.​
-- Scientologists "win" big time too, because the toxic wave of destruction that the cult leaves in its wake is far too extensive and extreme for it's own parishioners to ignore---particularly when they find themselves in the crosshairs of ops to "utterly destroy" them! In being so gruesomely obvious about devastating individuals, friends & families, the cult effectively delivers the most valuable (and only) "ability attained" on the entire grade chart---the ability to escape. Total freedom--from the cult.​

As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1"

FINAL NOTE: So many thoughts and memories flooded in while reading your insightful post! Even this wacky but perhaps true realization (sparked by your airport anecdote) that is remarkably reminiscent of Godwin's Law.

GODWIN'S LAW
As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a
comparison involving NAZIS or HITLER approaches 1.

HOAX'S LAW
As an online discussion about Scientology grows longer,
the probability invoking "OT PARKING WINS" approaches 1."


.
That was a good one HH.

I learned something here. Did not know about Godwin's Law.

This is a little off the topic TRUST but This Nazi/Gestapo Label ~~ I have to say ~~ has been used by the cult for decades.
The Clearwater Sun was the local newspaper in Clearwater and because they did not like the fraudulent undercover underhanded way of purchasing the Fort Harrison by calling themselves "United Churches of Florida" ~~ they published all about it.

Scn cult went on the warpath. They had Sea Org members dress up in Nazi attire and march up and down outside the Clearwater Sun offices daily.
It was a shock for sleepy Clearwater with only a 30,000 population back in the 1970s.

The Clearwater Sun folded and closed down.
The Guardian's Office drank champagne.


nazi-scieno.jpgneNazi.marching.jpg
 

No One

a girl is no one
Over three decades out of the Sea Org and I still trust people too easily, giving them the benefit of the doubt, then get aggravated when they walk all over and abuse me and I have to take action and I hate hate hate hate hate doing that. By then, it takes a real hard kick in the gonzos, and I can kick real hard, but :wtf: ??? Why can't people just act decently in the first place? Why do assholes just walk all over other people? Why the f do I have to show I can kick harder anyway just to protect myself? I don't want to kick anybody, but there you have it.

I see the best in people first. That kind of sucks, because people are a combination. Seeing the best in them seems to give them an excuse to act their worst. They want to be beaten? Okay, there ya go then. I don't get it.

I'm being really sincere here.

Anyone have a better approach? I'm open to it.
I have this same exact problem. My only thoughts on a better approach is to TRUST your instincts if something seems off. and to try to have people earn trust not just give it away for free... Still that is so difficult for people who think like us, the way you described.

I never knew how bad people could be until I was working in a field where I had a lot of interaction with people from all walks of life, not just some fortune 500 company or a bubble like the SO / Staff.

It's like 'they' can smell it on us.... that we are or could be an easy mark. a friend of mine suggested a shock piece of jewelry like an app for a watch or maybe something that recognized the words... when we start saying 'maybe I can Hel...(p)....' BANG it shocks you. hahahha.


Dang.
 

Enthetan

Veteran of the Psychic Wars
When nothing I was promised when I was recruited for the Sea Org actually panned out, that should have told me all I needed to know about Scientology organizations and "trust".

Every agreement you make with them is completely one sided.
Every agreement you make with them is inherently one sided, since you have no way to make them comply with the agreement (at least, not without getting yourself declared).
 

JustSheila

Well-known member
I have this same exact problem. My only thoughts on a better approach is to TRUST your instincts if something seems off. and to try to have people earn trust not just give it away for free... Still that is so difficult for people who think like us, the way you described.

I never knew how bad people could be until I was working in a field where I had a lot of interaction with people from all walks of life, not just some fortune 500 company or a bubble like the SO / Staff.

It's like 'they' can smell it on us.... that we are or could be an easy mark. a friend of mine suggested a shock piece of jewelry like an app for a watch or maybe something that recognized the words... when we start saying 'maybe I can Hel...(p)....' BANG it shocks you. hahahha.


Dang.
Awesome post. So true. :bighug:
 

Karen#1

Well-known member
Why do some friendships just fizzle ?

I was reading how as one grows older and time marches on, certain friendships are lost and simply fizzle. It seems like the Internet CREATES a platform where that can happen more easily. Its unclear what can't be forgiven (to end the friendship) the actual upset~~ or the public airing of the grievance.


Publicly voicing my disagreements with the cult and especially the malicious held against will at INT Base personally by David Miscavige blocking me seeing me 2 year old Alexander....that was considered SUPPRESSIVE to voice. Only SPs would publish their TRUTHS ! Instant disconnection of lifelong friendships.
And it is in the cult.

These end of friendships can be hard to process and understand, because although we accept divorce is just part of marriage not working out,

Then there is the unfriending of you because you are still friends with THEIR enemy or perceived enemy. If I unfriended every single person others demanded I unfriend I would be a lonely only. I refuse to Hide my friends. Why should I ?

I recently experienced the loss of a friendship due to not being willing to let the person stay in my home as a guest for 1 week. Jeff and I were OK for a shorter stay but not not for the full week. So communication was cut and a long friendship ended. No matter what I had done for the person in the past over time.

I have seen a feeling of entitlement can be a contributing factor to the fizzling of a friendship.

TRUST is breached once the friendship is severed. Even if it is feebly patched up later.

Thoughts ?


FB.friends.hide.png
 

Paul Adams

(Dulloldfart on ESMB)
Every agreement you make with them is inherently one sided, since you have no way to make them comply with the agreement (at least, not without getting yourself declared).
Yeah. Way back in 1972 before I had joined the SO, I was on the comm course and had been regged for the HQS course but hadn't signed up for it. I was visiting my mother and had the enrolment forms with me. I remember saying to her how totally one-sided this contract was, in that they promised absolutely *nothing* -- and I chuckled and saw nothing wrong with that. I was a goner after just 2 weeks! Heh.
 

lotus

rebel french frog
Hello Karen,

My personal experience regarding friendship taught me a few things regarding these issues you mention; Among them,

  • This is not a law but I often observed that the longer it took to establish the pillars, the values and concrete fundations of a relationship ( love, friendship etc) , the stronger and the longer it may last. A small rain shower won't kill it, neither bigger issues; When people have built strong boundaries they don't easily let it go. When it comes cloudy they will open to each other to clear the sky and allow the sun back.

  • Relationships that have been quickly developed and that are not based on solid mutual knowledge, admiration and respect often end when the first clouds appear.

  • When people easily give up without trying to resolve the misunderstandings happening here and there, it tells the pillars, the foundation were not deeply rooted to resist long time the normal life and relationship challenges.
Also, a very basic truth is that some people deserve to be enthrusted, while some others don't. Their behavior and set of values speak for it.

Just my two cents

Bye
Lotus
😉
 
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Type4_PTS

Well-known member
<snip>
Then there is the unfriending of you because you are still friends with THEIR enemy or perceived enemy. If I unfriended every single person others demanded I unfriend I would be a lonely only. I refuse to Hide my friends. Why should I ?
<snip>

<snip>
I recently experienced the loss of a friendship due to not being willing to let the person stay in my home as a guest for 1 week. Jeff and I were OK for a shorter stay but not not for the full week. So communication was cut and a long friendship ended. No matter what I had done for the person in the past over time.
<snip>
Both of these types of things I quoted above are not something one should be entitled to expect from a friend. I would have absolutely zero right asking you to unfriend one of your friends because I see them as my enemy.

I might express my opinion about this other person, or give a warning if I feel that s/he is a destructive person. But to demand that you unfriend them is disrespecting you, attempting to breach a boundary that I have no right to do.
 

Karen#1

Well-known member
I want to tell another tale regarding TRUST.
Youngster Brandon Reisdorf 3rd Gen Scientologist was seductively recruited to work as staff in San Diego Org.
Little did he know....
First they gouged and high pressured him for $60,000 money he did not have as a staff member in an empty org.
Then when his parents got declared Suppressive Person in 2016, his brother Craig was forced to disconnect.
Brandon had a meltdown.
THEN
He was put through a sadistic INTROSPECTION RUNDOWN.
He trusted this group.
He trusted the cult because his mother Lois Reisdorf was an early messenger who spent 6-8 hours a day with Hubbard for about 10 years.
So much for the TRUSTBrett.Brandon.Craig.jpg
They battered him and to punch up the story and make the point, see next post.
Image: 3 brothers" Brett, Brandon and Craig.
 
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Karen#1

Well-known member
In order to emphasize what the cult did to drive this youngster insane after ripping off $60,000 and causing him to lose his credit, I am telling a story of comparisons

Today I want to share a story to make a point on CULT conduct.

Nicholas Green (September 9, 1987 – October 1, 1994) was an American boy who was shot and killed in an attempted car robbery while vacationing with his family in Southern Italy. Robbers mistook their family car for a jeweller's. When Nicholas died, his parents chose to donate his organs.
Died: October 1, 1994
Born: September 9, 1987 San Francisco.

Sibling: Eleanor Green
Parents: Margaret, Reginald Green
Reginald Green , A journalist who symbolized the very best of America and it this is the story.
Nicholas Green, his sister, Eleanor Green, and their parents, Margaret and Reginald Green, were having a holiday in Calabria, Southern Italy. On the night of September 29, 1994 his parents were driving on the A3 motorway A car followed them and the men pulled up alongside the Greens' vehicle and shouted something in Italian, which the Greens did not understand. Reginald Green accelerated, at which point the men fired shots into the rear of the car. 7 Year old Nicholas wasshot in the head, went into a coma and then died. He did not make a sound.

But before he did, his parents made a decision which would change the lives of seven families across Italy - they decided to donate his organs and corneas for 7 Italians to live and get eyesight.
Italy was stunned with the grace and forgiveness of parents losing a 7 year old and donating his organs so that other Italians might live.

Did they scream for police to find the shooters ? Did they make hate pages on the dangers of vacationing in Italy?

NO
The parents were invited by the hierarchy in the Italian Government. Following their decision of donating Nicholas' organs, Nicholas' parents were received by Italy's President (Oscar Luigi Scalfaro). They were awarded Italy's highest honor for civilians "Medaglia d'Oro al Merito Civile"

The media and culture could not forget the gesture.
In Italy, there are more than 120 places named in Nicholas Green’s honor:
  • 50 squares and streets
  • 27 parks and gardens
  • 27 schools
  • 16 other monuments and installations, including a lemon tree, a bridge and an amphitheatre
Italy was shaken and very grateful.
Now lets take the cult of Scientology.
Youngster Brandon Reisdorf a 3rd generation Scientologist was staff at San Diego Org.
|He was co-erced into putting $60,000 on credit cards to the cult,. Money he did not have.
When Brandon chose to leave the Church after his parents were declared Suppressive Person in 2016, his brother Craig remained a Scientologist. The idea of losing his sibling sent Brandon into a spiral. Brandon was very close to Craig. Outcome was Brandon had a psychotic episode and had an enforced “Introspection Rundown” making him WORSE.
In a conversation with Leah Remini and Mike Rinder, Brandon claimed that he was at the home of two Scientologists trained in the process for approximately six weeks, and that he was watched “basically for 24-hours around the clock.”
“I was locked in a room for 24 hours a day,” Brandon shared, “experiencing craziness in my mind. It was just colors and pictures and hallucinations.

It was only after this barbaric therapy “Introspection Rundown” that Brandon drove up from San Diego and threw a brick at Los Angeles Org glass window.
Ahhhhh the rage of the cult. The vindictiveness. The revenge. In the first part of this essay I told about parents with grace even after the death of their son.
Compare with the cult reporting Brandon as a felon, taking him to court, causing him to have a felony record for the rest of his life, all of which occurred AFTER their Introspection Rundown and extorting $60,000 from this youngster. Brandon signed up for staff TRUSTING the cult.
Not only did they drive him insane, get $60,000 out of him, but got him a felony record for slinging a brick through a glass window.

There are consequences for TRUSTING the cult of Scientology.


Not only is the cult incapable of grace and forgiveness, it acts completely like a bunch of mob thugs.
Mobsters kill and dole out severe beatings, but do not drive a target insane.
The Cult of Scn does this.
Images:
Nicholas Green
Brandon ResidorfBoy.Nicholas.jpgBrandon_Reisdorf3-e1485314390788.jpg
 
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