OTVIIIs take the darnest courses...

Karakorum

The most ethical being in the gullibxy
I saw a lot of people who completed OTVIII then go on afterwards to complete some very basic intro stuff like "Handbook for preclears" or "student hat" etc. This came up in the threads about Grant Cardone and his 2D, notably the following:
Grant Cardone Lays Off 80 of His 180 Employees Without Notice: 10X Being Hammered to -OX by the Coronavirus?

Grant Cardone Lays Off 80 of His 180 Employees Without Notice: 10X Being Hammered to -OX by the Coronavirus?

I wouldn't be myself (old inv habits die hard) if I didn't check other people to see if it is a pattern within the whole organisation. Surprise, surprise - it is a pattern. Example:



Really an all-powerful OTVIII still has a need to do student hat? Seriously?
Question to all auditors: What is the point of that? Shouldn't OTVIII be perfect already and do nothing except condescendingly smirk at others while waiting for OT IX to be released?
 

Dotey OT

Pan Determined Pandemic Panglossian Non-Pansophist
I saw a lot of people who completed OTVIII then go on afterwards to complete some very basic intro stuff like "Handbook for preclears" or "student hat" etc. This came up in the threads about Grant Cardone and his 2D, notably the following:
Grant Cardone Lays Off 80 of His 180 Employees Without Notice: 10X Being Hammered to -OX by the Coronavirus?

Grant Cardone Lays Off 80 of His 180 Employees Without Notice: 10X Being Hammered to -OX by the Coronavirus?

I wouldn't be myself (old inv habits die hard) if I didn't check other people to see if it is a pattern within the whole organisation. Surprise, surprise - it is a pattern. Example:



Really an all-powerful OTVIII still has a need to do student hat? Seriously?
Question to all auditors: What is the point of that? Shouldn't OTVIII be perfect already and do nothing except condescendingly smirk at others while waiting for OT IX to be released?
I noticed that as well and wondered that there was something that I just didn't know. It was like pulling teeth to get an OTVIII into the org, with rare exception. There are people in the org's field that I never met, and they were OTVIII. Maybe they are on this board!!!
 

Dotey OT

Pan Determined Pandemic Panglossian Non-Pansophist
... And Wayne Fuller used to drive around recruiting for Tampa back in the day. He carried a letter from DM, about Wayne taking on Tampa. I can't recall exactly, but I believe it was something along the lines of seven league boots. I said it and did not vomit.
 

ILove2Lurk

Lisbeth Salander
. . .
Can't help but mention a couple of real-life outcomes from the top of the bridge.

I know of a well-known, still-active FSM and public speaker. Both he and his wife are OT8, Class 8, all Ls, experienced in the chair, fifty-year veterans. They've inherited family money and live in a beautiful somewhat exclusive area, so day-to-day financial pressures don't seem like an issue. He's still doing the traveling "major FSM shtick" and she's at home being really depressed from what he's privately revealed. Every day. He's hoping that the upper OT levels (9&10) will finally handle her. The whatever it is. That's what he's pinning all his hopes on to resolve his situation at home. The "next level" phenomenon.

He obviously didn't get the memo that the upper OT levels don't exist. Believer to the end.

Here's another example:

Kevin Bloody Mackey | January 19, 2013 at 3:02 am [posted on Marty's blog]
Really? For many years a lofty state of “Operating thetan” was alluded to in the CofS. Promo was sent out depicting a being exterior in space, references were made to remote viewing, x-ray vision, telekinesis and abilities that we’d had trillenia ago that were now lost. The state was described in great detail in many of LRH’s tapes. The bridge itself showed seven levels above OTVIII ending in “Power on all Dynamics” and “Total Freedom”. In the “Clear to Eternity” HCOB LRH told of the long haul above the ‘pre OT’ levels on the final band of case gain. I myself had my eye firmly on the ‘mountain’ for my 26 years in the Corporate Church of the Holy Ponzi Scheme. It kept me going for 15 years on the squirrel wheel to insanity called Solo Nots. When my wife attested before me and slumped into depression. I hoped for many levels above VIII as I knew OT VIII didn’t address her difficulties or the ones I was facing.
I have difficulty reconciling my personal experience with your post Marty. Obviously you were privy to more information than me, but Jeez, I wish I’d known that when I was doing ‘baby watch’ on type three OTs.
I’d have thrown in the towel years ago. It really hurts to hear that there was nothing above OTVIII, even within anyone’s delusions.

Happens more than people know. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
 

NotsoNutsoNow

Active member
. . .
Can't help but mention a couple of real-life outcomes from the top of the bridge.

I know of a well-known, still-active FSM and public speaker. Both he and his wife are OT8, Class 8, all Ls, experienced in the chair, fifty-year veterans. They've inherited family money and live in a beautiful somewhat exclusive area, so day-to-day financial pressures don't seem like an issue. He's still doing the traveling "major FSM shtick" and she's at home being really depressed from what he's privately revealed. Every day. He's hoping that the upper OT levels (9&10) will finally handle her. The whatever it is. That's what he's pinning all his hopes on to resolve his situation at home. The "next level" phenomenon.

He obviously didn't get the memo that the upper OT levels don't exist. Believer to the end.

Here's another example:

Kevin Bloody Mackey | January 19, 2013 at 3:02 am [posted on Marty's blog]
Really? For many years a lofty state of “Operating thetan” was alluded to in the CofS. Promo was sent out depicting a being exterior in space, references were made to remote viewing, x-ray vision, telekinesis and abilities that we’d had trillenia ago that were now lost. The state was described in great detail in many of LRH’s tapes. The bridge itself showed seven levels above OTVIII ending in “Power on all Dynamics” and “Total Freedom”. In the “Clear to Eternity” HCOB LRH told of the long haul above the ‘pre OT’ levels on the final band of case gain. I myself had my eye firmly on the ‘mountain’ for my 26 years in the Corporate Church of the Holy Ponzi Scheme. It kept me going for 15 years on the squirrel wheel to insanity called Solo Nots. When my wife attested before me and slumped into depression. I hoped for many levels above VIII as I knew OT VIII didn’t address her difficulties or the ones I was facing.
I have difficulty reconciling my personal experience with your post Marty. Obviously you were privy to more information than me, but Jeez, I wish I’d known that when I was doing ‘baby watch’ on type three OTs.
I’d have thrown in the towel years ago. It really hurts to hear that there was nothing above OTVIII, even within anyone’s delusions.

Happens more than people know. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
Not meaning to evaluate but have you ever read the end phenomena of Grade 1 (Extended Rudiments/$cientology Expanded Lower Grades) Problems? Unless I am mistaken anyone completed on that grade should be 'no longer worried' and 'free from worry' regarding problems. I guess El Con was telling porky pies again. (Ref: HCOB/PL 23 October 1980 Issue II Revised 16 November 1987 CHART OF ABILITIES GAINED FOR LOWER LEVELS AND EXPANDED LOWER GRADES (Extended Rudiments) (The Bridge to Total Freedom Classification, Gradation and Awareness Chart of Levels and Certificates for Dianetic$ and $cientology Training and Therapy) Online edition.)
 

pineapple

On the Dole
I've noticed this phenomenon of OT's doing intro-level courses. I guess they have to keep regging them for something to keep them coming into the org where they'll be exposed to the continual brainwashing. If they let them just sit around at home it'll start to wear off and buyer's remorse will set in.
 

Karakorum

The most ethical being in the gullibxy
I've noticed this phenomenon of OT's doing intro-level courses. I guess they have to keep regging them for something to keep them coming into the org where they'll be exposed to the continual brainwashing. If they let them just sit around at home it'll start to wear off and buyer's remorse will set in.
That's a great observation.
I was initially thinking of: "They still want to contribute to the org or help stats go up, but ran out of sensible courses so they just take whatever". Your interpretation seems more plausible.
 

marra

Still standing
Yes, they can't be allowed to go off-lines so they have to be kept busy in the org. Plus all orgs are mainly interested in stats so they push that button a lot - student points, course completions, blah blah. As if it makes any difference in the real world.
 

Dotey OT

Pan Determined Pandemic Panglossian Non-Pansophist
I saw it in CW with OT public. There didn't seem to be the pressure put on OT comps as others. When the SRD came out newly, that motivated some of the more active ones to get into a course and do auditing, but not too many of those even. It's like there wasn't specific direction given to push someone that was already through the bridge.

In outer orgs, more often than not, the OTs in the field would claim Flag as their org, and that would monumentally chap the CL V org folks. Flag tour reges would often get in comm with those types and berate them for not supporting the local org.
 

La La Lou Lou

Well-known member
My guess is that OTs are under enormous pressure to be seen to be on lines doing well and contributing to the cult. If they can't pay for a Patron membership for their maid they can at least do an introduction to ARC mini course, that will keep the ethics officer on the Freewinds from demanding they come and confess for five intensives room and board and visits to the reg.
 

HelluvaHoax!

Well-known member
.

. . .
Can't help but mention a couple of real-life outcomes from the top of the bridge.

I know of a well-known, still-active FSM and public speaker. Both he and his wife are OT8, Class 8, all Ls, experienced in the chair, fifty-year veterans. They've inherited family money and live in a beautiful somewhat exclusive area, so day-to-day financial pressures don't seem like an issue. He's still doing the traveling "major FSM shtick" and she's at home being really depressed from what he's privately revealed. Every day. He's hoping that the upper OT levels (9&10) will finally handle her. The whatever it is. That's what he's pinning all his hopes on to resolve his situation at home. The "next level" phenomenon.

He obviously didn't get the memo that the upper OT levels don't exist. Believer to the end.

Here's another example:

Kevin Bloody Mackey | January 19, 2013 at 3:02 am [posted on Marty's blog]
Really? For many years a lofty state of “Operating thetan” was alluded to in the CofS. Promo was sent out depicting a being exterior in space, references were made to remote viewing, x-ray vision, telekinesis and abilities that we’d had trillenia ago that were now lost. The state was described in great detail in many of LRH’s tapes. The bridge itself showed seven levels above OTVIII ending in “Power on all Dynamics” and “Total Freedom”. In the “Clear to Eternity” HCOB LRH told of the long haul above the ‘pre OT’ levels on the final band of case gain. I myself had my eye firmly on the ‘mountain’ for my 26 years in the Corporate Church of the Holy Ponzi Scheme. It kept me going for 15 years on the squirrel wheel to insanity called Solo Nots. When my wife attested before me and slumped into depression. I hoped for many levels above VIII as I knew OT VIII didn’t address her difficulties or the ones I was facing.
I have difficulty reconciling my personal experience with your post Marty. Obviously you were privy to more information than me, but Jeez, I wish I’d known that when I was doing ‘baby watch’ on type three OTs.
I’d have thrown in the towel years ago. It really hurts to hear that there was nothing above OTVIII, even within anyone’s delusions.

Happens more than people know. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
.

Those were rather illuminating narratives about the Bridge experience! On that topic, here is an excerpt from Don Hubbard's (see avatar) bestselling book:


THE CREATION OF HUMAN HAPPINESS
-A Concise History of Happyology -
  • Scientist promises a Bridge to Total Happiness.
  • People spend fortunes and 25 years to attain Total Happiness.​
  • Despite a jumbo certificate with the word "HAPPY" on it, they are still unhappy.​
  • Scientist researches this complaint and discovers the reason.​
  • Breakthrough is celebrated, people purchase new advanced level 3, the Wall of Unhappiness.​
  • People move thru the Wall of Unhappiness, but still feel unhappy for some strange reason.​
  • People invest fortunes/decades more on expanded Wall levels (4,5,6,7 & 8).​
  • Despite a jumbo certificate with the word "SUPER-HAPPY", they are still unhappy.​
  • People interested in refund cannot locate scientist who has closed lab and moved off grid.​
  • New Scientist makes another huge discovery, that all prior customers are evil and/or insane and nobody should talk to them because THEY are the actual cause of unhappiness.​
  • Happyologists rejoice that they can now become happy by purchasing/doing Wall levels 9 & 10.​
  • New Scientist delays release of the miraculous key to happiness levels until the lab buildings are all remodeled with marble floors--requiring additional billions of dollars and decades to achieve.​
  • Happyologists happily sell all their earthly belongings and bury themselves in loan debt in order to take responsibility for the remodeling that will guarantee their happiness, at some point in the future.​
  • Happyologists, still unhappy, are advised to "Act happy and soon you will find something to be happy about" which restores their hope they will eventually attain Total Happiness--and that makes them feel kind of happy--so that confirms that the HappyTech is working.​
  • Happyologists who, despite all the above HappyTech, still do not feel happy are sent to ethics to find and disconnect from the SP that is causing their unhappiness (SP = Sad Person). By eliminating all contact with SPs, Happyologists are always surrounded by winning happy people and thus they can continuously rehab each other's happiness by sharing happy success stories.​
.
 
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I told you I was trouble

Suspended animation.
I saw a lot of people who completed OTVIII then go on afterwards to complete some very basic intro stuff like "Handbook for preclears" or "student hat" etc. This came up in the threads about Grant Cardone and his 2D, notably the following:
Grant Cardone Lays Off 80 of His 180 Employees Without Notice: 10X Being Hammered to -OX by the Coronavirus?

Grant Cardone Lays Off 80 of His 180 Employees Without Notice: 10X Being Hammered to -OX by the Coronavirus?

I wouldn't be myself (old inv habits die hard) if I didn't check other people to see if it is a pattern within the whole organisation. Surprise, surprise - it is a pattern. Example:



Really an all-powerful OTVIII still has a need to do student hat? Seriously?
Question to all auditors: What is the point of that? Shouldn't OTVIII be perfect already and do nothing except condescendingly smirk at others while waiting for OT IX to be released?
I'm pretty sure they don't re-tread those courses by choice, they were/are ordered to redo them. I recall when all the basic books got rewritten that everyone was told courses already paid for and studied were no longer considered completions and they had to do the 'new' courses all over again!

:D

Unbelievable really.

Also many are forced to redo basic courses when working through the conditions. Even Jane Kember (ex Guardian WW) was seen in the course room doing basics like a newly in culty.

It's just more of the usual cult rip offs as far as I can see, everyone has to pay the full cost to do it all again as well.
 

Bill

Well-known member
I've noticed this phenomenon of OT's doing intro-level courses. I guess they have to keep regging them for something to keep them coming into the org where they'll be exposed to the continual brainwashing. If they let them just sit around at home it'll start to wear off and buyer's remorse will set in.
When I was on the OT Committee at Flag, we were all told to go to the Tampa Org and take introductory courses to boost their stats so they'd go "Saint Hill Size" (or whatever).

"Most ethical people" my ass.
 

Karakorum

The most ethical being in the gullibxy
I'm pretty sure they don't re-tread those courses by choice, they were/are ordered to redo them. I recall when all the basic books got rewritten that everyone was told courses already paid for and studied were no longer considered completions and they had to do the 'new' courses all over again!

:D

Unbelievable really.

Also many are forced to redo basic courses when working through the conditions. Even Jane Kember (ex Guardian WW) was seen in the course room doing basics like a newly in culty.

It's just more of the usual cult rip offs as far as I can see, everyone has to pay the full cost to do it all again as well.
Yeah I thought about that, but my first reaction was that they would have chosen more expensive courses to redo.

Though student hat costs 600 now? eek

 

F.Bullbait

Wise Guy
Back in the 70's, I saw an OT7 get reged for Life Repair which was the bottom of the grade chart at the time. He was very happy with the results.

I imagine you could go up the chart over and over with happy results until your bank account is drained and you have pawned all your stuff. You then would be totally free. :woohoo:
 

HelluvaHoax!

Well-known member
.
When I was on the OT Committee at Flag, we were all told to go to the Tampa Org and take introductory courses to boost their stats so they'd go "Saint Hill Size" (or whatever).

"Most ethical people" my ass.

LOL !!

That's the COS! (Church of Statboosting). Here are a few more examples. . .

"Everyone loves us--we have 20 million members!"
FACT: Approximately 97.5% of people who bought a book or tried a course blew and there are now only appx. 20 thousand (not million) Scientologists worldwide after 70 years of "miracles". If Scientology had ever once even demonstrated ONE miracle, they would now easily have over 200 million members!

"Everyone loves Battlefield Earth--Ron's book is on the bestseller list with over 4 million copies sold!"
FACT: The COS (Crimewave of Scientology) had Scientologists defraud the NYTimes bestseller list during its initial release (2001-2005) when it sold 29,000 copies. Nearly all of those copies were purchased by straw "book buying" Scientologists who were donating hundreds of thousands of dollars of their personal money so that cult operatives could mob bookstores and buy the copies en mass.


RECAP: Scientology stats are like the Clear Cog--

"I am mocking up my own bank (membership numbers, book sales, miracles. . .)"

.

 

JackStraw

Well-known member
I'm pretty sure they don't re-tread those courses by choice, they were/are ordered to redo them. I recall when all the basic books got rewritten that everyone was told courses already paid for and studied were no longer considered completions and they had to do the 'new' courses all over again!

:D

Unbelievable really.

Also many are forced to redo basic courses when working through the conditions. Even Jane Kember (ex Guardian WW) was seen in the course room doing basics like a newly in culty.

It's just more of the usual cult rip offs as far as I can see, everyone has to pay the full cost to do it all again as well.
I was around for 30 or so years and when DM's GAT came out, I saw auditors personally trained by Hubbard required to take these new courses. Their previous certs were cancelled and were not allowed to audit until they did the GAT.

Many left...

I had done the Student Hat, followed quickly by the MCSC & internship (think of the student hat on steroids), and immediately onto & through the Pro Word Clearer's course & internship (all the study materials from student hat & MCSC, yet again) + how to use an e-meter and all the methods of word clearing. A few years later I was ordered to the GAT student hat course. I thought it, well, unnecessary.

Jack
 
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