Minus brainwashing, with actual origins exposed, is anyhing good left in Scientology?

I told you I was trouble

Suspended animation.
Most of us are still talking about it with each other because we were part of an experience that not many others have shared ... and we also still come here because many of us have become friends and enjoy chatting about things that often have no relation to scientology at all.

So, in answer to your question ... no, there is nothing left that is good in scientology, nothing at all ... there never was anything good about it in the first place.

It's still the same tired but clever old con that it ever was, but now it has a few more bells and whistles due to the wealth accumulated and miscaviges determination.
 

Chuck J.

Election Fraud Has Consequences
Anything good?

Hmm, ...................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................... the food, lol no.............................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................. lemme think...................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................................... the....................... no...................................................................................... I can't think of anything right this sec. I'l get back to ya tho'
 

Veda

Well-known member
Most of us are still talking about it with each other because we were part of an experience that not many others have shared ... and we also still come here because many of us have become friends and enjoy chatting about things that often have no relation to scientology at all.

So, in answer to your question ... no, there is nothing left that is good in scientology, nothing at all ... there never was anything good about it in the first place.

It's still the same tired but clever old con that it ever was, but now it has a few more bells and whistles due to the wealth accumulated and miscaviges determination.
Posts such as the opening one on this thread are really meant for lurkers who still think there's some value in Scientology. A chorus of, "It's all bullshit," etc. will not reach such people.
 

He-man

Hero extraordinary
Posts such as the opening one on this thread are really meant for lurkers who still think there's some value in Scientology. A chorus of, "It's all bullshit," etc. will not reach such people.
If you had asked me 20 years ago - I would have written a KR on you and started doing my o/w write up.

If you had asked me 15 years ago - I would've smiled nervously and taken up Ethics tech, auditing and the greens as awesome, but that for some reason it seemed to me that the organization had become corrupt and wasn't applying KSW, because if they did, everything in Scientology would be so easy. Then I'd run a mile away from trying to confront any thing related to Scientology and thank the gods I was away from all that for the moment. I'd still consider meself a scientologist though.

If you had asked me 10 years ago - I would have just realized it was all just bollox. A mindfuck! That had trapped us all! My whole family ripped apart for a fraudulent lie that had us believe there was a pot of gold at the end of the rainbow. Nothing good to be seen, it's all bull!

If you had ask me today, well, I don't think there is anything good with Scientology, what little "good" Ron scavenged from other self help ideologies, you can easily use someplace else without the mindfuck that we know as Scientology. For me, at least I think I feel that I got a story to meself, something that I can relate to. I understand what happened to me, my family and why.


Short answer, there weren't ever anything good left in Scientology, at least not for me and my family, and a majority of all people who has since then left. I'd love to adhere to an illusion that there was something to salvage, but hey, once awoken....
 

Karakorum

Broke ranks over 10 years ago, never looked back
I think a society of open-minded people offering mutual counseling and sound therapy is a good idea.
Scientology is not a society of open-minded people and auditing is not a sound therapy.
 

I told you I was trouble

Suspended animation.
Posts such as the opening one on this thread are really meant for lurkers who still think there's some value in Scientology. A chorus of, "It's all bullshit," etc. will not reach such people.
Well perhaps you should have made that clear Veda and I wouldn't have bothered posting and I doubt if anyone else would have done either ... which would have just left the opening post for any lurkers to glance at.

:blink:
 

He-man

Hero extraordinary
Well perhaps you should have made that clear Veda and I wouldn't have bothered posting and I doubt if anyone else would have done either ... which would have just left the opening post for any lurkers to glance at.

:blink:
Also.

Who is to say that the Chorus of Scientologys bullshitedness doesn't reach people? I'm a lizard-man and it still reached me even though I have a hard time hearing.
 

stratty

Inveterate gnashnab & snoutband
Posts such as the opening one on this thread are really meant for lurkers who still think there's some value in Scientology. A chorus of, "It's all bullshit," etc. will not reach such people.
I don't think the lurkers are going to be very impressed when they read the title of the thread. There's still time @Veda...
 
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Chuck J.

Election Fraud Has Consequences
Also.

Who is to say that the Chorus of Scientologys bullshitedness doesn't reach people? I'm a lizard-man and it still reached me even though I have a hard time hearing.
I thought you were Bludbaden?
 

Chuck J.

Election Fraud Has Consequences
Yes, even I think there are some parts of scientology that are useful. But you have to separate them from the $cientology. And the "ironic" thing is a lot of those parts are other peoples' ideas. Study Tech? Has a usefulness, Charles Berner and wifes' - not Hubbard's idea. etc etc etc. n00b's please read The Sole Source Myth.

And I don't even fault Hubbard for collating workable info... or whatever you want to call what he was doing. But I do have a problem with him appropriating other peoples ideas and calling them his own.
 
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Bill

Well-known member
Yes, even I think there are some parts of scientology that are useful. But you have to separate them from the $cientology. And the "ironic" thing is a lot of those parts are other peoples' ideas. Study Tech? Has a usefulness, Charles Berner and wifes' - not Hubbard's idea. etc etc etc. n00b's please read The Sole Source Myth.

And I don't even fault Hubbard for collating workable info... or whatever you want to call what he was doing. But I do have a problem with him appropriating other peoples ideas and calling them his own.
In my opinion, when Hubbard stole concepts from others, he completely ruined those concepts because he had to "improve" everything by reducing everything down to a set procedure, an unvarying process, a code, a scale, a chart.

As an example: The perfectly usable "if you don't understand a word, look it up" becomes "You must look up every word you read, in a dictionary, every definition of that word, no matter how obscure, then look up every word in those definitions ... and every word in those definitions ...". Which changed the simple "understand what you are reading" into "nightmare word chain black hole".

Another example: Condition formulas. They were "workable" only in very simple, unique conditions. In real life they didn't work. Hubbard corrupted "Recognize how you are doing and continue good things and remedy bad things" into rote "formulas" that were useless but had to be complied with.

Hubbard could take any useful concept and make it unworkable.
 
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Harden Long

OSA no esta hermOSA
Blubbard took the Berner's study tech and made a monster out of it which killed all study in Scientology, what last gasps of breath it had were smothered by DuM DuM.
All study was endlessly Dev-T'd by course sups harassing students over the most miniscule and insignificant word definitions.
I just continued to look up words that were pertinent to my understanding of that which I was seeking to understand and blew off the rest as bs token terminology thrown in merely to impress the student with claimant source's vocabulary when I did my class IV.
Consequently I blew through my training. It really shouldn't take more than a week or two per level of training, including drills if you have a twin. It's only about asking rote questions according to C/S instructions with metering thrown in, why should that be difficult and time consuming to learn as it's all about basics? On each subsequent level, much of what you're reading was just read and checked out on the previous level anyway.
It's only difficult BECAUSE of the bullshit word clearing that constantly breaks one's train of thought to chase down rabbit hole after rabbit hole of unrelated word chains to the subject at hand.
Because of his extremism or as he has put it, "typically overzealous nature", LRH misused word clearing and it ruined study in Scientology.
 
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Karakorum

Broke ranks over 10 years ago, never looked back
Blubbard took the Berner's study tech and made a monster out of it which killed all study in Scientology, what last gasps of breath it had were smothered by DuM DuM.
All study was endlessly Dev-T'd by course sups harassing students over the most miniscule and insignificant word definitions.
I just continued to look up words that were pertinent to my understanding of that which I was seeking to understand and blew off the rest as bs token terminology thrown in merely to impress the student with claimant source's vocabulary when I did my class IV.
Consequently I blew through my training. It really shouldn't take more than a week or two per level of training, including drills if you have a twin. It's only about asking rote questions according to C/S instructions with metering thrown in, why should that be difficult and time consuming to learn as it's all about basics? On each subsequent level, much of what you're reading was just read and checked out on the previous level anyway.
It's only difficult BECAUSE of the bullshit word clearing that constantly breaks one's train of thought to chase down rabbit hole after rabbit hole of unrelated word chains to the subject at hand.
Because of his extremism or as he has put it, "typically overzealous nature", LRH misused word clearing and it ruined study in Scientology.
I 100% agree with what you mentioned. World benchmark of a post.

TRs are minor annoyances (except bullbait, which is actually decent). But study tech is actual torture. I'm being serious and honest - putting kids though Hubbard's study tech should be seen for what it is - child abuse.
 

Edwardo

Member
I think it depends where you start from, and what you lose on the way.

It has been been soul-destroying and life-destroying for many people, and it wasn't unalloyed joy for me either.

However, I wasn't doing well before I started, and so I got quite a lot from the experience.

1. I got a better work ethic.
2. I learned to be wary of drugs.
3. It gave me confidence in my ability to learn and understand things. An overblown confidence, but still helpful.
4. It taught me to turn up on time.
5. It gave me an assortment of tools and bits of knowledge, some of which are either useful or interesting.
6. I met some great people who were trying to save mankind.
7. After leaving, I became allergic to cults and religion.
8. I'm resistant to hard-sell and other sales inducements.
9. Since leaving I've enjoyed being an ex-Scientologist, as I like reading the perspectives I read on the message boards.
10. My experiences in Scientology weren't unusual for ex-Scientologists, but they were different from the ones most people have, and these have altered my perspective.
 

Xenu Xenu Xenu

Well-known member
It was never a "clever" con.
You do have a point there.

I remember finding Scientology a little fishy right from the start but I still joined. It started with an intro course and after a while I went from "checking Scientology out" to being "in Scientology". From there, within a matter of months I joined staff and "became a Scientologist".

There was a lot of scolding, peer pressure, hard-sell, obvious lying, and badgering involved. I don't find that so much clever as it is more "brutal", "direct", and "crude". Some people wouldn't have put up with that, but I did. That's why I am here now on this board.

Perhaps, others were more cleverly fooled but that wasn't me. The only clever part in my case was the fact that once I bought into all that nonsense, I spent the remainder of my time in the cult brainwashing myself. That certainly was clever.
 

Riddick

I clap to no man
I think it depends where you start from, and what you lose on the way.

It has been been soul-destroying and life-destroying for many people, and it wasn't unalloyed joy for me either.

However, I wasn't doing well before I started, and so I got quite a lot from the experience.

1. I got a better work ethic.
2. I learned to be wary of drugs.
3. It gave me confidence in my ability to learn and understand things. An overblown confidence, but still helpful.
4. It taught me to turn up on time.
5. It gave me an assortment of tools and bits of knowledge, some of which are either useful or interesting.
6. I met some great people who were trying to save mankind.
7. After leaving, I became allergic to cults and religion.
8. I'm resistant to hard-sell and other sales inducements.
9. Since leaving I've enjoyed being an ex-Scientologist, as I like reading the perspectives I read on the message boards.
10. My experiences in Scientology weren't unusual for ex-Scientologists, but they were different from the ones most people have, and these have altered my perspective.
why did you leave?
 
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