Lee Spewing again....

No One

a girl is no one
Hilarious! A short Flag Order on competence with a big typo ("assure" instead of "assume").
Wow, and to think I had a to the comma, to the letter standard-tech kind of mindset back then.

That sentence didn't look right to me, so thanks for confirming it.

I really sat here and reread it a few times trying to make assure fit in there and I couldn't see anything but assume.

I wonder if star-rated which definition of assure the student should give and how to try to make it make sense in that context.

That would have been hours of me sitting there playing with the demo kit in a kinda bored trance. Having some micro-sleep,
but also kinda thinking how could it be wrong??? How could it have been issued incorrectly like that and missed giving it a whole different meaning.

My 'study bug' and I could have really benefited from knowing that the tech was not infallible, not all always correct, and obviously not to the comma and letter must be followed.

DAMN again. So obvious!


:bug:
 

Enthetan

Veteran of the Psychic Wars
How many people here are out within the last five years? Three years?? One year? If you don't want to answer, don't, just curious.
It depends on your definition of "out".

I had stopped doing services for years prior to openly breaking with them.
 

No One

a girl is no one
It depends on your definition of "out".

I had stopped doing services for years prior to openly breaking with them.
I agree it reallllly depends on what one thinks of as out.

It seems like some get out and they are just done right then and there.

My leaving process took place over a period of years, and I do not mean on the rpf, ha ha ha.
First physical out, then mental layers, then more layers, then a short try back to attempt to solve a relationship problem, then out again, as in not participating... but not fully out out in my mind until I had realized and accepted that it was all 'woo' as Chris Shelton would say. This unfolded for me on ESMB and I am so thankful for it.

That is when I finally felt ok, I'm out out for good, no turning back. Even proved it to myself when taking an anti anxiety pill and whoop... done! Illegal PC forevermore. I guess that reading the OT Level stuff available online was the same thing from a COS viewpoint, but one little xanax to really cement it in.

Then again I'm UTR due to friends & or family still in... so I still have a chain, just not willing to break that chain just yet.

Does that count as out? Out but not free of the negative effects... it's too much to think about. Once/if that chain is broken I would be speaking out loudly and consistently... I might even get a hate page or fair gamed... so is there ever really a fully out?

Gah!

-a girl is no one
 

Dotey OT

We Finally Got a Puppy!
I left Scientology about five years ago after twenty five years in.
Thanks for answering! Not many answers, or not willing to answer. I have been thinking that for the most part, the participants here have been out a lot longer that I have been. I think there are many that have been out before I joined. I joined around 1989, and have really been out since 2017.

And again you don't have to answer, I assume that you went through ideal org fundraising as well?
 

Glenda

Well-known member
How many people here are out within the last five years? Three years?? One year? If you don't want to answer, don't, just curious.
Hi Dotey OT,
I'll answer because it really doesn't matter much to me these days how long I was involved with scientology or how long I have been away from it all. There is an integration of the past and a fresh approach to how I live life, moving forward type thing.

In 20 years. Now in my 11th year of being out of the mad world of scientology.

The first few years out were rough. I had some traumatic shit to deal with. Did some deep inner work. Had to do it to save myself. I really wanted to grow old with some peace and joy so got stuck in and re-built my inner world while I bashed around in life pretty damn lost. Learned more in those few years than I had in all my scientology years. Intense stuff but worth it.

Now doing my best to live life in a very quiet peaceful way. Grateful to be alive and to get to experience life through my own eyes. Life is sometimes not perfect - far from it - but at least I can honestly say I am living life with my own thoughts, my own responses and untainted emotions that are all nicely integrated (most days) with my past. The automatic crap installed by the scientology methods is probably 99% gone but I don't think I can measure this accurately. It feels like trying to measure how long is a piece of string - scientology methods go deep and can activate without any warning.

I am on a bit of a rave here so will say one more thing before I wander off to do some laundry (real life in action is full of beautiful mundane activities). Life without scientology in either an external influencing form or an internally influencing manner is amazing. It was so hard for me to get to this place (fuck off violins playing in background, just saying it like it was). Most days I silently celebrate the sense of liberation that runs through every moment.

My genuine wish is for everyone that leaves scientology to find their own inner peace and joy. :flowers:
 

Enthetan

Veteran of the Psychic Wars
Thanks for answering! Not many answers, or not willing to answer. I have been thinking that for the most part, the participants here have been out a lot longer that I have been. I think there are many that have been out before I joined. I joined around 1989, and have really been out since 2017.

And again you don't have to answer, I assume that you went through ideal org fundraising as well?
I stopped doing services around 2000 or so. Did not explicitly break with them until the "Basics" release resulted in them calling me at all hours of the day and night, waking me up, and resulting in me screaming at them to get the fuck off my lines.
 

Type4_PTS

Well-known member
Thanks for answering! Not many answers, or not willing to answer. I have been thinking that for the most part, the participants here have been out a lot longer that I have been. I think there are many that have been out before I joined. I joined around 1989, and have really been out since 2017.

And again you don't have to answer, I assume that you went through ideal org fundraising as well?
I'm not unwilling to answer. I included those details in my "new member intro" thread.
In for 10 years and left 30 years ago.
 

Dotey OT

We Finally Got a Puppy!
I agree it reallllly depends on what one thinks of as out.

It seems like some get out and they are just done right then and there.

My leaving process took place over a period of years, and I do not mean on the rpf, ha ha ha.
First physical out, then mental layers, then more layers, then a short try back to attempt to solve a relationship problem, then out again, as in not participating... but not fully out out in my mind until I had realized and accepted that it was all 'woo' as Chris Shelton would say. This unfolded for me on ESMB and I am so thankful for it.

That is when I finally felt ok, I'm out out for good, no turning back. Even proved it to myself when taking an anti anxiety pill and whoop... done! Illegal PC forevermore. I guess that reading the OT Level stuff available online was the same thing from a COS viewpoint, but one little xanax to really cement it in.

Then again I'm UTR due to friends & or family still in... so I still have a chain, just not willing to break that chain just yet.

Does that count as out? Out but not free of the negative effects... it's too much to think about. Once/if that chain is broken I would be speaking out loudly and consistently... I might even get a hate page or fair gamed... so is there ever really a fully out?

Gah!

-a girl is no one
I know what you mean! I started "seeing the light" maybe seven or eight years before I officially left. I made mine official the moment that I knew I never would do another service, ever again. I might be on the fringe, but I would rather have a blow up than reveal. I'm still connected in certain ways, unfortunately. My "anxiety pill" moment was when I decided I would surf the web for the truth, with no fear of consequences because I was never going back!

I love your story!!
 

Dotey OT

We Finally Got a Puppy!
I got out in Dec 07.
I was still in then, but I was snowed. I disagreed with the basics bullshit, and the ideal org project smelled fishy. However I worked for a whale, if you can believe that. Not going to say too much, but I was in the thick of stuff, at least at my org. I went clear at Flag five years after you were out. Or whatever clear is, or isn't. I bought around ten sets of basics. One for me, a couple for the org, some dono's elsewhere, one set when I routed out of the S.O.
 

Dotey OT

We Finally Got a Puppy!
I stopped doing services around 2000 or so. Did not explicitly break with them until the "Basics" release resulted in them calling me at all hours of the day and night, waking me up, and resulting in me screaming at them to get the fuck off my lines.
I was mid the PTS/SP course when the basics came out. I screamed for the reference that said I needed to go back and do whatever the pre-reqs were then, I thing you had to do DMSMH and SOS. No one could get me a reference, and I started to get into ethics trouble. That was really the beginning or the end for me, it just took another ten years. That was an expensive ten years in many, many ways.

But I will say this, life is great now, lots of peaks and valleys emotionally, but we're free and we know it!
 

Type4_PTS

Well-known member
Sorry, wasn't intending to infer that you didn't. Thought that those that didn't answer, just didn't. But thanks!!
While I physically left 30 years ago I was not fully out at that point. I was still pretty much trapped in the prison of belief.
That was back in 1989 when none of the current information on the internet was available as yet.

The internet was harmful to the CoS in many ways, including this way: :D

ohfuckinternetishere.jpg
 
D

Deleted member 51

Guest
In the Sea Org 9 years. Left the Sea Org and most of Scientology in 1986. It took another three years or so for Scn friends to wander off when I was "inactive on the Bridge" and I moved completely away from California and across the country then.

I never looked at the remnants of what was still Scientology think in my head until I got on ESMB about nine years ago.
 

Dotey OT

We Finally Got a Puppy!
In the Sea Org 9 years. Left the Sea Org and most of Scientology in 1986. It took another three years or so for Scn friends to wander off when I was "inactive on the Bridge" and I moved completely away from California and across the country then.

I never looked at the remnants of what was still Scientology think in my head until I got on ESMB about nine years ago.
My whole existence in scn was after you left. I should have asked you!!

I was one of those that energetically followed (most) rules once I got in. A very good friend of mine was surfing the web at night while her husband was asleep, looking at "entheta." Her husband told me about it so I spoke with her. This was around 2007-2008. She said "you won't believe some of the things written about scn and Ron." I sent her to the org, and she got "handled." She passed away as a scn, and I still think about that now and then.
 

Dotey OT

We Finally Got a Puppy!
in 4 1/2 years, left in '97. Been out over 22 years and NEVER looked back. My only connection these days is to provide assistance for those wishing to leave, and following MB posts, blogs etc......
I was in during your time in. Thanks!
 

Karakorum

Broke ranks over 10 years ago, never looked back
But realize that I do harbor much ill will and feeling for SO personnel in general. (my spewing)
You have a right to feel that.
No hard feelings on my end. I'm saying this as a 2nd gen who has been at some point public, staff and SO. I realize that by being in SO (and dept 3 in particular) means I've spent a fair amount of my life being an enforcer for a high control group.

I can't fix any of that, but I can at lest be frank about it and accept the facts for what they are.

I would really like some former SO to talk about how they viewed Public......what their Execs thought and said in relation to Public....what sort of Orders they got in how to deal with Public.
Sure.

How did I view the public? I guess the best analogy that comes to mind is how US career soldiers view US national guards. "Yeah we are more dedicated, better trained, more professional and in general its a much bigger part of our life. But in the end, we are all playing for the same team".
Moreover, due the nature of my post and our team, we tended to look at each person separately. We had acces to the files, the KRs, auditing session recordings... not to mention all the cases attached to a profile in our system.
In some sense many people "moved through my desk" as just numbers on a spreadhseet. At the same time some people were fully fleshed individuals, whose tastes, views and behavioral patterns I could know and learn without ever meeting the person face-to-face.

Though my view might have not been entirely typical, as I had lost my faith in the tech pretty early. Duty - yes. Responsibility - yes. A "job to be done well" - yes. Holy mission - nope.

This all impacted how I viewed the public, but at the end of the day the focus of most of our actions were staff and the SO. Not least because that's where most KRs originated and most of the investigations involved them.


As for other parts of the cult: My impression was that RTC and CMO int people were the most likely to fall into the: "Better than thou" mindset in their dealings with others. But perhaps that view is also biased, as I'm drawing this from my PAC and WUS experiences. Also, not everyone at CMO int was the same.

Were Public just fodder?
Yes, but so were staff, SO, RTC honchos and everyone else. In the grand scheme of things, we were cogs in a machine. Bigger and smaller cogs, but all just cogs.

Did any SO ever care about an individual Public in the Cult? (except as a source of money)
It is hard to answer without knowing what you exactly mean by "care". I know a few SO that went out of their way, sometimes risking being assigned lower conditions or jeopardizing their career simply to right some wrong that was done to a member of the public.

We had put some people through the ropes hard, but at the same time people worked hard to exonerate subjects of investigations that they believed were ujnustly blamed by their enemies. Each person a story of his own.

Public KRs were just someone angry at someone else over something stupid and just wanted to get it off their chest. Buy a diary, people!
Word!

Trust me: 20 years after you left nothing has changed with regards to public KRs.

As staff in an org, I had to make enough money moonlighting to make ends meet and pay child support. Oh yeah, I got divorced because of the cult. So I would make maybe $2,000 a year, and have to moonlight evenings and weekends to pay for a place to live, food, gas and child support.
I know exactly what you mean (though I never had to pay child support). As a staff in an org, I worked 7 days a week and couldn't make ends meet given California living costs. Joining the SO actually was a relief as far as finances were concerned.
 
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