DO YOU FEAR DEATH?``

Dan

Meh
I'm not afraid of death, if it truly is death. As in D-E-A-T-H. Frankly, I don't want after body death consciousness. No, not even if it is "good". I don't want to live again in another incarnation. And I don't want to hang around disembodied either. I don't want to haunt a place.

I don't believe in any of the major religion's viewpoint or teachings on what happens. They're full of dogmatic shit. I don't consider Buddhism to be a religion, but it may be the closest to the truth. I don't know, and I hope not. I want to be dead, dead, dead! But, that's probably not how it works. Damn!

This podcast I just discovered is pretty much on this topic, so to speak. I've listened to four episodes so far, which covers two stories. Both of them do not give me much hope as to what happens after the ol' body is dropped. The second story is downright disturbing. It appears that how you die is pretty important. (Don't get brutally murdered by a very evil dude)

But I do not recommend this podcast, although it is very well done and I like the guy who puts it together. It's riveting. But by all means, don't listen to it! But if you do, be sure to start at episode one and do them in order. I've been to some of these places featured as it is an Austin based podcast. Several years ago I could have recommended another one for him to do a story on.

Okay, here it is, the link you should ignore.....


I mean it! Do not click!
 
D

Deleted member 51

Guest
I'm not afraid of death, if it truly is death. As in D-E-A-T-H. Frankly, I don't want after body death consciousness. No, not even if it is "good". I don't want to live again in another incarnation. And I don't want to hang around disembodied either. I don't want to haunt a place.

I don't believe in any of the major religion's viewpoint or teachings on what happens. They're full of dogmatic shit. I don't consider Buddhism to be a religion, but it may be the closest to the truth. I don't know, and I hope not. I want to be dead, dead, dead! But, that's probably not how it works. Damn!

This podcast I just discovered is pretty much on this topic, so to speak. I've listened to four episodes so far, which covers two stories. Both of them do not give me much hope as to what happens after the ol' body is dropped. The second story is downright disturbing. It appears that how you die is pretty important. (Don't get brutally murdered by a very evil dude)

But I do not recommend this podcast, although it is very well done and I like the guy who puts it together. It's riveting. But by all means, don't listen to it! But if you do, be sure to start at episode one and do them in order. I've been to some of these places featured as it is an Austin based podcast. Several years ago I could have recommended another one for him to do a story on.

Okay, here it is, the link you should ignore.....


I mean it! Do not click!
:LOL: I'll listen.

I think you'd like the Taoism view. It's not Buddhism. There is no "coming back" as a reincarnated entity with a Nirvana /heaven etc. end in sight after you've become a better being. There is just life force. There is no mention of retaining your personality or even cognizance after death. I've wrestled with that idea for many years... how I would feel about losing all cognizance forever and just going back into the life continuum, no longer any sort of defined life form. It is unsettling to me, so I prefer Christianity. Still, a lot of the Taoist teachings help me live better and make sense. Taoism is against a separation of spirit and body or a view that spirit is senior to or inhabiting the body. They are two sides of the same and inseparable.

I'll probably get over my re-discovered fascination with Taoism in a couple of months. :LOL: But it is amazing to me how deeply philosophic, humane and gentle mankind was over 2500 years ago compared to current times.
 

Dan

Meh
:LOL: I'll listen.

I think you'd like the Taoism view. It's not Buddhism. There is no "coming back" as a reincarnated entity with a Nirvana /heaven etc. end in sight after you've become a better being. There is just life force. There is no mention of retaining your personality or even cognizance after death. I've wrestled with that idea for many years... how I would feel about losing all cognizance forever and just going back into the life continuum, no longer any sort of defined life form. It is unsettling to me, so I prefer Christianity. Still, a lot of the Taoist teachings help me live better and make sense. Taoism is against a separation of spirit and body or a view that spirit is senior to or inhabiting the body. They are two sides of the same and inseparable.

I'll probably get over my re-discovered fascination with Taoism in a couple of months. :LOL: But it is amazing to me how deeply philosophic, humane and gentle mankind was over 2500 years ago compared to current times.
I used to believe in the older, very much older, Christian view of dying and remaining dead until the future resurrection. Christianity ended up adapting as the centuries rolled on the more Hellenized and Platonic view of the soul immediately continuing to live after body death. I was content with the being dead and then resurrected in the future concept. But.....probably not true. Dang!
 

Veda

Well-known member
I used to believe in the older, very much older, Christian view of dying and remaining dead until the future resurrection. Christianity ended up adapting as the centuries rolled on the more Hellenized and Platonic view of the soul immediately continuing to live after body death. I was content with the being dead and then resurrected in the future concept. But.....probably not true. Dang!
Have you heard of trans-humanism? They fully intend to live forever.

This video begins with a trans-humanist being uncharacteristically blunt.


The trans-humanists like to present themselves as being humanitarians, when they are, in fact, anti-human advocates of de-population.
 

Dan

Meh
Have you heard of trans-humanism? They fully intend to live forever.

This video begins with a trans-humanist being uncharacteristically blunt.


The trans-humanists like to present themselves as being humanitarians, when they are, in fact, anti-human advocates of de-population.
Oh yes. I'm quite aware. This is the dawning of the age of Transhumanism. What a nightmare.
 

Karakorum

Broke ranks over 10 years ago, never looked back
The more I read John Muir, the more intelligent statements I find.

I think he put my own position on death in nicer and more pretty words than I could have done:

 

La La Lou Lou

Well-known member
The more I read John Muir, the more intelligent statements I find.

I think he put my own position on death in nicer and more pretty words than I could have done:

Yes indeed, we are out of touch with the most important part of life. The bit we all do, regardless of wealth or social standing, despite education, life dies. I am not sure if I find it joyous, but it is a part of life and the plant that dies after flowering and growing seeds fertilizes the ground for it's offspring to grow in.

One thing, at least in the UK, is that people mostly live in cities, they have no idea that their beefburgers once ran around playfully on chalky hillsides, they just see packets of equally weighed clean dry minced red stuff. Watch how playful young cows are, watch pigs being pushed into transport and listen to them squealing when they arrive at the abattoir. People who live in 'primitive' conditions know their meal, personally, they have fed their pigs, they herded their cows and they respect them, they know they are living creatures that died so that they can eat them.

I can't justify eating animals, but I do, I know with a bit more effort I can make perfectly tasty and nutritious food without dead animals. I do know that they were once alive, that they had awareness of their existence. I am a lapsed veggie.

If I was going to design biology I wouldn't have it built around things eating each other. I would not have designed wasps that lay eggs in other insects so their young could feed on living flesh. I wouldn't have designed fungus's that grew through ants heads. Mother nature isn't soft and fluffy, that's for sure. Living in nature is fascinating, but despite their ability to make lovely music birds live most of their days terrified of bigger birds or cats. There certainly is a lot more to nature than buying a bunch of pretty flowers from the petrol station (gas store).

Children do indeed learn that pets do die no matter how much you hug them. It's not fair, but life isn't.
 

Karakorum

Broke ranks over 10 years ago, never looked back
I can't justify eating animals, but I do, I know with a bit more effort I can make perfectly tasty and nutritious food without dead animals. I do know that they were once alive, that they had awareness of their existence.
I understand that point of view, though I find it impossible to evade the logical consequences of adopting it. If I were to adopt the belief that eating meat is inherently evil, then I would need to extend it not only to my "fellow man", but also to my fellow chimpanzees and wolves.

At some point I would be forced into a position to consider the wasp evil because it feeds its babies with the flesh of other animals. Then I would need to consider the hornet to be evil, because the hornet feeds her own babies with the babies of the wasp. If we go far enough, this becomes a self-defeating argument, at least for me.

I think that vegetarian Buddhists, despite their belief in universal reincarnation, deep down believe that we people are somehow better than the chimpanzee, the wolf or the hornet.

I don't think that we are any better.

If I was going to design biology I wouldn't have it built around things eating each other. I would not have designed wasps that lay eggs in other insects so their young could feed on living flesh. I wouldn't have designed fungus's that grew through ants heads. Mother nature isn't soft and fluffy, that's for sure. Living in nature is fascinating, but despite their ability to make lovely music birds live most of their days terrified of bigger birds or cats. There certainly is a lot more to nature than buying a bunch of pretty flowers from the petrol station (gas store).
That's exactly what I meant. Nothing truly wild is squeaky clean. But its equally true that “nothing truly wild is unclean” - that's also John Muir for you.

I can't even reach a point where I could say how I would have designed it myself. When faced with the sheer enormity and complexity of the biosphere, I can only stand in wonder and awe.

Than the awe grows even more once I consider the fact that nature's work is very far from being done. The biosphere and all its history from the first cell till now is a mere fraction of the time this planet has. That "the world, though made, is yet being made; that this is still the morning of creation ". How can I consider how I would have designed it, if what I understand is only a fraction of a fraction of a tiny moment in time?
 
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D

Deleted member 51

Guest
I’ve often thought about the sheer evil of Scientology, how often the lessons taught were completely diametrically opposed to ancient wisdom, values and truths.

Like Hubbard’s emphasizing ego, achievement and vain certificates of personal higher statuses or huge donations on a stage in front of cheering crowds. Hubbard glorified vanity and personal power. These were exactly the sort of evils that everyone from the Christmas Grinch to Aristotle to Confucius to Jesus Christ warned against- the selfish motives that empty the soul.
 
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Karakorum

Broke ranks over 10 years ago, never looked back


Life and death are a natural continuum. A fallen tree makes room and light for new saplings to grow in its place. It feeds numerous fungi and beetle larvae.

Life and death are not worlds apart, they are not even two sides of the same coin. They are the same side.

Even within the death of a single tree, one can see the triumph of life as a whole. The challenge is being able to see the same in the inevitability of one's own death.
 
D

Deleted member 51

Guest


Life and death are a natural continuum. A fallen tree makes room and light for new saplings to grow in its place. It feeds numerous fungi and beetle larvae.

Life and death are not worlds apart, they are not even two sides of the same coin. They are the same side.

Even within the death of a single tree, one can see the triumph of life as a whole. The challenge is being able to see the same in the inevitability of one's own death.
What a beautiful, eloquent post.

Scientology was so focused on identity: your identity now, identities of others, identities you and others have been.

But it’s not just in auditing - the Scientology focus on identities saturates the admin tech, too, from ethics conditions to find out that and who you are and joining or leaving a group identity to focus on your hat and defining one’s self according to your job.

Is identity important to a spirit?

When we die, will we even have a personal identity anymore?

If spirit follows the laws of physics, then spirit is recycled, nurturing the next growing spirit like the disintegration of tree roots nourishing budding plants after a great tree dies and falls.

Is it really so bad to no longer have an identity and start over? Nature does it all the time, but even the concept of losing self is too horrifying for most to imagine.

Because we have an identity, we think not having one would be obliteration and permanent death. But is it?
 
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